Multivan vibration query

[Silver Caravelle]

It's quite possible mate. Another one to check out would be the timing gears. If you have a stethoscope you could narrowed down.

Thanks Transporter. Definately hope it is not those internal timing cogs. I suspect not, as the engine is smooth and vibration free otherwise.

Regards,

Scott

[Silver Caravelle]

Dear all,

I managed to have a bit of look over the weekend. I pulled the tray off and checked the engine mounts as best as one can on their own. The transmission left mount is easily checked as it is exposed in the left front wheel arch! This one seems like a pretty basic arrangement compared to the other mounts I can see.

What is evident ( and is normal in my view) is that at idle, the engine pulses can be felt by hand through this mount (but not through to chassis), drive shafts and tyres. It was difficult to fully check the other mounts. Either way, pulses still felt through the steering wheel as previously described.

Also I picked up secondary matter of a loose heat shield when shoving one's hand up past the steering rack, lower engine mount and drive shaft area - below the turbo area. The heat shield can hardly be seen. The problem is that I could not see properly to determine how/where it mounted by feeling around. Would anybody have any pictures or diagrams of this part of the engine bay? It is a separate heat shield to the large one under the floor above the exhaust a DPF. Whilst it is probably not contributing directly to the pulsing I am feeling through the steering wheel, I am sure it drumming against the steering rack/lower engine mount area creating some further unwanted harmonic vibration.

Thanks,

Scott

[Silver Caravelle]

Hi, I thought I would provide an update.

Last weekend I pulled the engine tray off again and had another prod around.

The lose soft (heat or is it engine noise reduction?) shield attached to the engine block just above the sump on the back of engine - below the turbo, I could not locate anywhere where it fastens. So to stop it sliding around, I managed to bend the bottom lip of it slightly so it wedges tightly above and against one of sump cover rubber lugs. No more movement! I am not sure it really made any difference overall though.

I also from front to back of the vehicle made sure all heat shield bolts and those round fasteners were all tight (which they weren't overly) and checked exhaust joins for tightness (OK).

I am now fairly certain there are no engine mount issues. The idle throbbing through the steering wheel (in drive) comes and goes and is likely to be the engine running slightly lumpy at times, to hardly noticeable at other times. Possibly better with warmer outside temperatures and perhaps the engine mounts on are a little firmer in cooler temperatures, thereby transmitting more harmonic idle vibration. I will just put it down to engine characteristics for now. If it gets worse (which it hasn't so far ) it may become more obvious.

The thing I find most annoying and tiresome regarding driving this TDi auto is that there is a fair amount of drivetrain rumble and resonance in the 1200 RPM to 1700 RPM range when the engine is lugging in gear. The tendency particularly in city driving is for the auto to change up quickly meaning that in particular 4th, 5th, and 6th there is a fair amount of drive train rumble and resonance and turbo noise. If you use sport mode the gears hang on for a little too long. It seems as if the shift points are either too high or too low! I think it is also exacerbated by slight intake drone noise. But the air box seems to be fastened correctly with good mountings.

Another thing I have noticed listening in the engine bay is slight but non specific faint metallic noise. Could this be just general PD engine injection noise or something more sinister?

Thanks,

Scott

[Tornado T5]

The thing I find most annoying and tiresome regarding driving this TDi auto is that there is a fair amount of drivetrain rumble and resonance in the 1200 RPM to 1700 RPM range when the engine is lugging in gear. The tendency particularly in city driving is for the auto to change up quickly meaning that in particular 4th, 5th, and 6th there is a fair amount of drive train rumble and resonance and turbo noise. If you use sport mode the gears hang on for a little too long. It seems as if the shift points are either too high or too low! I think it is also exacerbated by slight intake drone noise. But the air box seems to be fastened correctly with good mountings.

Thanks,

Scott

The auto is adaptive so maybe resetting it might help you with shiftpoints.
http://www.vwwatercooled.org.au/newf...88&postcount=3

[Silver Caravelle]

The auto is adaptive so maybe resetting it might help you with shiftpoints.
http://www.vwwatercooled.org.au/newf...88&postcount=3

Thanks Tonardo.

I reset according to the instruction. I confess to not noticing any real difference.

City driving usually means the engine tending to lug in 4th, 5th (sometimes 6th) in the say 60 to 80 Km/h range. The the tiptronic seems to be programmed to shift up into the highest gear at the earliest opportunity, hold in that gear and not go back to a lower gear too easily even on a slight incline (unless in sport mode). One has to give the accelerator a fair nudge to bring into an appropriate lower gear. I assume this is for intended economy reasons.

Whilst it will pull OK at lower revs (say 1300, to 1400 revs), it is not 'on the cam' so to speak, with plenty of annoying intake drone noise, drive train rumble/vibration when lugging along - something I have found a little hard to get use to after owning petrol engined vehicles previously. Is this normal behaviour for one of these or is there more intake drone noise, drive train rumble/vibration than there should be in my vehicle?

PS: Any thoughts regarding the non specific faint metallic noise?

Regards,

Scott

[BrianJ]

Thanks Tonardo.
Whilst it will pull OK at lower revs (say 1300, to 1400 revs), it is not 'on the cam' so to speak, with plenty of annoying intake drone noise, drive train rumble/vibration when lugging along - something I have found a little hard to get use to after owning petrol engined vehicles previously. Is this normal behaviour for one of these or is there more intake drone noise, drive train rumble/vibration than there should be in my vehicle?

PS: Any thoughts regarding the non specific faint metallic noise?

Regards,

Scott

My 2006 96kw tiptronic multivan beach has an intake vibration/drone between idle and about 1500rpm, then it sharply cuts out and you just hear the normal diesel sound. I still don't know what it is after spending some time listening with my wife controlling the rpm.

My drivetrain does not have any noise, or annoying vibrations through the car though.

A lot can be said for a loud radio at these times.

Brian

[Silver Caravelle]

My 2006 96kw tiptronic multivan beach has an intake vibration/drone between idle and about 1500rpm, then it sharply cuts out and you just hear the normal diesel sound. I still don't know what it is after spending some time listening with my wife controlling the rpm.

My drivetrain does not have any noise, or annoying vibrations through the car though.

A lot can be said for a loud radio at these times.

Brian

Brian,

Perhaps what you describe is what I am also experiencing over the same rev range and I am confusing drive train 'vibration' with a combination of this intake vibration/drone and engine lugging in the higher gears at lower revs (which exhibits some slight drivetrain rumble) with the amount of torque going through the drive shafts under this driving condition.

Mine is quite crisp once out of this intake droning noise and engine lugging range. Just becomes a bit tedious driving around town at times with the tendancy to shift into higher gears early.

Many thanks.

Regards,

Scott

[BrianJ]

Brian,

Mine is quite crisp once out of this intake droning noise and engine lugging range. Just becomes a bit tedious driving around town at times with the tendancy to shift into higher gears early.

Many thanks.

Regards,

Scott

I have noted that my speedo reads low by about 2.5km/hr at 60, and 5km/hr at 100, so I travel at 65 in town and 105 or 115 on the highway, and usually sit evenly with the other traffic. Because of the speed I do in town, it usually sits in 5th gear, not 6th. This gives it a rev range just higher than the buzzy noise, and is quite smooth even down to 1200rpm. In fact I am very impressed how it can pull so smoothly at this low rpm.

Brian

[Silver Caravelle]

I have noted that my speedo reads low by about 2.5km/hr at 60, and 5km/hr at 100, so I travel at 65 in town and 105 or 115 on the highway, and usually sit evenly with the other traffic. Because of the speed I do in town, it usually sits in 5th gear, not 6th. This gives it a rev range just higher than the buzzy noise, and is quite smooth even down to 1200rpm. In fact I am very impressed how it can pull so smoothly at this low rpm.

Brian

Hello Brian,

Thanks for the feedback.

The 96kw has slightly lower gearing than the 128Kw. I drove one as a loan vehicle and it struck me it was a little better and smoother for city driving in terms of less lugging than my 128kw.

I will learn to live with it - or drive it in sport or tiptronic mode when doing city driving!

Cheers,

Scott

[Tornado T5]

Hello Brian,

Thanks for the feedback.

The 96kw has slightly lower gearing than the 128Kw. I drove one as a loan vehicle and it struck me it was a little better and smoother for city driving in terms of less lugging than my 128kw.

I will learn to live with it - or drive it in sport or tiptronic mode when doing city driving!

Cheers,

Scott

Hi Silver Caravelle,

Having just had the auto changed over for very rough changing and flaring (under warranty) I went through a phase straight afterwards of almost paranoia listening to ever sound, feeling every gear change just to see that nothing was wrong. Two weeks later and I would swear this replacement box is smoother than the original unit….but I really don’t know.

I find that my T5 128kW is loud on acceleration, has some vibration and then goes very quiet at cruise. I have a van with aftermarket lining throughout the cargo area so it will sound different to a Caravelle as well. I agree it does change up as quickly as possible (too quickly for economy as you suggest) and needs a real prod past the kick down switch to get it downchanging.

I also have a Falcon G6E turbo and driving styles are so different, the Ford is a wolf in sheep’s clothing and it goes from 0 to loss of licence in 5+ secs. Its engine is very smooth and the gearbox is one of the world’s best, ZF sachs. Then again the T5 would tow a jumbo and on refills can show a range of 800km+. I drive the two vehicles differently, such as how I use the throttle, I let speed build in the T5 etc…I recently had a Caddy as the loan vehicle, DSG box and that needs a slightly different driving technique to a T5 auto, eg rolls back on inclines before forward is engaged however gear changes are very smooth.

When I reset my gearbox, before the replacement, it made a huge difference and then got worse so it was a different situation. Due to my lack of mechanical knowledge all I can suggest is you just drive it for a while, try to ignore the vibrations etc and if you can drive another exact spec version make a comparison then. You’ll go crazy trying to solve something in the meantime and forgot how much fun a T5 can be, or so I discovered.

Driving in sport mode in the CBD isn't such abad idea although it does revs it's head off before changing..somewhere in between would be ideal. In Melbourne's CBD, driving in manual mode, I think I'd need three hands, those pesky pedestrians don't understand what "red flashing light means" and hook turns, keeping the turn indicator down/up and steering the wheel becomes "fun". Don't know how I did it when I had a manual...must be getting lazy...