Red Devil mkII - The Journey Continues

[seangti]

**** FOR SALE **** $12K


Hi,

As Anthony had decided to part with the Red Devil, I saw it an opportunity to buy the car for regular track work.

I'd been teetering with the idea of buying it over a few months when he first announced selling. I gave in to the idea after a track day where an RX7 and GTR punched the wall. Plus I have plans on lots of track time this year, so rather than dump money into the current silver one, thought it's money better spent sitting in an already exceptionally well built car. I'd initially considered it as a daily, but rather than soften it up and detune to make it more streetable for my requirements, I thought it'd be a waste of the hard work that's gone in to it, so will keep flying the track oriented theme.

On the immediate horizon is getting baseline performance figures; 0-100kph, rolling speed intervals, lap times at he local tracks and quarter mile. I'll share that once compiled.

RE mods, before track time next weekend I will soften up the front sway bar to dial out some understeer / promote more movement in the rear. Though will be replacing the coilovers in the next month or two, likely to H&R or KW's. I also an expect an LSD will be needed, have done some research and likely to be wavetrac, will get some track time in it first before committing.

Build on the car when I took delivery. (http://www.vwwatercooled.com.au/forums/f127/little-red-devil-33911.html)


Enough waffling, I'm now sporting two Polo GTI's.
http://www.vwwatercooled.com.au/forums/images/imported/2014/05/201405241219042_zpsbeb5ded0-1.jpg (http://s1271.photobucket.com/user/seangt83/media/2014-05-24121904-2_zpsbeb5ded0.jpg.html)

http://www.vwwatercooled.com.au/forums/images/imported/2014/05/ba281711ed614a279546b45bc571bb7c_zps6577-1.jpg (http://s1271.photobucket.com/user/seangt83/media/ba281711-ed61-4a27-9546-b45bc571bb7c_zps65774b13.jpg.html)

Current Spec - Nov 2017
VAGAutowerks custom tune

3” cold air feed ducting
Modshack VTDA with custom cold air 3” ducting inlet with K&N pod filter
Custom alloy 3" MAF housing
Custom 3" turbo inlet pipe
Removed June 2015 Billet Turbo Ko3s Hybrid turbo with ceramic ball bearing conversion with Forge adjustable spring turbo actuator - yellow spring
FTG K04-001 with upsized wheels (62.3mm compressor, 46.4mm turbine wheels) with Forge adjustable spring turbo actuator. refer page 26+ for info and pics
Forge Motorsport 007P closed loop diverter valve with yellow spring rated 15-23psi
SEAT Sport intercooler - dual pass core
Custom pipe work - 2" hotside, 2.5" coldside to TB
Removed November 2014 ATP turbo hiflow exhaust manifold HPC coated - as it cracked. Running standard Manifold.
Custom stainless steel 3” dump pipe with 4" expansion chamber & Magnaflow 100 CEL catalytic converter
Custom 3" stainless steel catback exhaust with Magnaflow resonator & 6" round muffler with 42DD 4" outlet
Phenolic intake manifold gasket

ECS lightweight crank pulley
42 Draft Design Ultimate catch can with Morosso exhaust valve and PCV delete - currently removed
SAI Pump, N249 & N112 delete
Wahler 71c thermostat
Genesis II 500cc injectors
Bosch 3 bar FPR
APR high performance in tank fuel pump
Verdict Motorsport O2J aluminium shift bracket bushings
42 Draft Design aluminium shift cable bushings
Deka lightweight ETX14 battery 12lbs 5.4kg
Braille aluminum battery mount
NKG BKR7EKT spark plugs
Superpro sports dog bone bush
Vibra-Technics Gearbox mount
Vibra-Technics Engine mount
Audi A3 custom drive shaft
Sachs 228mm duty clutch plate
Sachs clutch pressure plate
ECS 14lbs light weight flywheel
Wavetrac LSD and rebuilt gearbox April 2016

Wiechers steel front strut brace
Ultra Racing front lower control arm brace
Ultra Racing rear lower brace
Ultra Racing middle lower brace
Whiteline adjustable front sway bar 22mm
Whiteline adjustable rear sway bar 20mm
Whiteline rear shim kit +3mm toe in reduction
H&R Coilovers (20-50mm lower) with Kmac adjustable camber and castor tops
Superpro anti-lift poly rear control arm bushes

Brembo 4 pot front brake calipers
QFM A1RM front
DBA 4000 312mm front slotted rotors
Audi TT rear brake calipers with VW Bora V5 All-wheel drive brake calipers
Lucas/TRW rear brake pads
RDA 256x20mm ventilated rear slotted rotors
HEL braided brake lines

Track: Enkei RPF1 17x8, 35ET, 15.5 lbs 7kg
225/45/17 Yoko AO50 Soft

Daily: Audi TT 17"
Federal RSRR215/40R17

MK5 Golf alloy steering wheel inserts
SWG air vent pod
Prosport Evo electronic boost gauge
Prosport Evo electronic EGT gauge
Prosport Evo electronic air fuel gauge

Ford Focus RS bonnet vents
APR Performance GTC-200 48" SCCA Spec. carbon fiber rear wing
Rear bumper valance delete with JMF alloy bumper diffusers

Sharan antenna
Badgless upper honeycomb grille
Fog lamp delete
Side skirt delete


Lap times (Official - natsoft):
Lakeside, QLD: 1:03.18 (on old turbo at 22psi, RE55s tyres)
- 1:03.2 (FTG turbo at 16 psi, V70 tyres)
- 1:02.99 (FTG turbo at 16 psi, V70 tyres, Wavetrac LSD)
- 1:02.86 (FTG turbo at 16 psi, Federal RSRR tyres, Wavetrac LSD)

Queensland Raceway
Sprint configuration - 1:00.596 29/09/18
Clubman configuration - 1:04.372 29/09/18
National circuit - 1:28.113 29/09/18
Sportsman Circuit - 1:01.913 29/09/18

19 Sept 2020
Sprint configuration - 1:00.274
Clubman configuration - 1:04.082
National circuit - 1:27.58
Sportsman Circuit - 1:01.677
Wakefield, NSW: 1:12.4 (on old turbo, RE55s tyres)

[h100vw]

LIKE, 10characters

[grandturismo]

Looking forward to seeing this car on the track Sean.
Congrats on the purchase and I'm sure the car will be something pretty special when your finished with it :)

[VWindahouse]

So much win coming soon :) Nice pics too!

[nat225]

http://www.vwwatercooled.com.au/forums/images/imported/2014/05/depositphotos_6323637FacebookLike-1.jpg

[team_v]

Can't wait to see this thing on Saturday's Happy Laps.

[jasn78]

Cant wait to see qtr mile time sean. I hope you meam wbank and not just gtech??

Sent from my GT-I9305 using Tapatalk

[seangti]

Cant wait to see qtr mile time sean. I hope you meam wbank and not just gtech??


Yup, willowbank mate, can't achieve bragging rights without a time slip :toast:

Though never done drags, so if I suck at it you may never know I'd tried, lol. Nah, I'll share my failures.

[jasn78]

Im sure u will be fine remember low psi front high psi rear and slip ckutch against handbrake to control tyre spin.

Also dont worry about the lights go anytime after green

Sent from my GT-I9305 using Tapatalk

[jasn78]

Or just use me as the driver pmsl

Sent from my GT-I9305 using Tapatalk

[seangti]

Had some track time at Queensland Raceway on the weekend, unfortunately an intercooler pipe blew off on the 3rd lap, but that was enough to get a feel for the car. The power and brakes are sweet, so much braking power from the Brembo brakes. Was pulling over -1g, whereas with the standard gear maxes at around -0.9g. That’s quite a difference. Accelerating, again is an extra couple of 10th’s in terms of g’s. I’m yet to run any acceleration times, but 80-120km/h is low to mid 3’s for 3rd gear.

Cornering, now that was interesting, in short it was nervous and unbalanced compared to my other car. Corner speed was down compared to the silver car too. I had adjusted the rear way bar to have it on medium, leaving the front on soft. I think I could run the rear on hard. It was nervous under brakes and mid corner, lacking feel. All of which I was aware of having had a steer at lakeside some months back. I put it done to the FK AK coilovers, I feel they are under damped, resulting in a pogo / porpoise effect. I’ve now ordered H&R coilovers.

RE Coilovers, I’ve had a preference for the H&R’s for some time, they use a monotube, inverted bilstein strut so I know quality is top notch. They aren’t rebound or damper adjustable, just height. I had also been looking at KW V3’s and KW Clubsports. If sourcing the gear locally, the price was much the same for H&R and KW’s, in which case I’d have gone KW Clubsports. But I’ve chosen to import the H&R’s, which are roughly half the price to sourcing locally. I’d have preferred to source locally, but the price difference was too much. The KW’s sourced in Europe versus local are only marginally cheaper. For all the negative comments of the H&R’s about firm ride, I’ve found as positive’s for my application. Lacking the adjustability isn’t so much an issue, as I can make minor adjustments with the swaybars. Plus the price difference covers a set of semi slicks, so my logic is H&R’s with semi slicks would result in better lap times than KW’s on street tyres.

That’s my rant, suspension should be here in 3 weeks.

[team_v]

Shame you only got a few laps in but hopefully you can give it a burl at Lakeside in July with the new suspension.

Does the red devil currently run Federal 595 RSR's?

[seangti]

Shame you only got a few laps in but hopefully you can give it a burl at Lakeside in July with the new suspension.

Does the red devil currently run Federal 595 RSR's?

Yes and yes. :P

[team_v]

Yes and yes. :P

So what semislicks would you be looking at getting?
I have heard the Advan Neova AD08R's are a pretty decent tyre.

[seangti]

So what semislicks would you be looking at getting?
I have heard the Advan Neova AD08R's are a pretty decent tyre.

Yup, a near certainty is the new yokohama's AD08's from the research amd feedback I've come across. Price wise for the 17" isn't unreasonable either. Alan (Granturismo) spoke highly of them after last weekends HUGE culling of his PB at lakeside. With suspension and tyres, I'm expecting at least 64's lap at lakeside in this car. I got 66.0 in the silver one on semi's so can't see it being a stretch.

[VWindahouse]

Hey mate, did you adjust the front sway to soft from what is was on?

[VWindahouse]

Shame you only got a few laps in but hopefully you can give it a burl at Lakeside in July with the new suspension.

Does the red devil currently run Federal 595 RSR's?

Only has the 595 EVO's at the moment Clay, the one's below the RSR Semi's. So Sean should see a massive improvement with the Advans :)

[seangti]

Hey mate, did you adjust the front sway to soft from what is was on?

I've just learned that I've been quite wrong for quite some time. Specifically relating to sway bar settings on this occasion, I had thought that the greater the leverage the stiffer the setting, which is wrong.

So the front is on hard (closest to the bar), rear is on medium. I'd recalled you saying it was set on hard, but when I looked at on saturday morning I thought, nope, that's soft, cool.

That means all this time I thought my silver car had been set on hard, but is in fact soft. Epic.

[VWindahouse]

Lol easy mistake to make mate. I'm glad we figured it out now though before your officially timed laps coming up.

Would have been really fun for you at QR being back to front on Saturday :)

[seangti]

Some goodies turned up for Red Devil

http://www.vwwatercooled.com.au/forums/images/imported/2014/06/IMG_1647_zpsdf823b3f-1.jpg (http://s1271.photobucket.com/user/seangt83/media/IMG_1647_zpsdf823b3f.jpg.html)

http://www.vwwatercooled.com.au/forums/images/imported/2014/06/IMG_1648v2_zps8413c542-1.jpg (http://s1271.photobucket.com/user/seangt83/media/IMG_1648v2_zps8413c542.jpg.html)

Ordered from Orange Tuning in Germany, couldn't speak highly enough of their communication and how quickly it arrive. Hopefully fit em over the coming week. Can't wait. :banana:

I'll probably have a mechanic mate do the install, any special tools required or tips to share before we start? I didn't bother doing the suspension in the silver car, it started with good intention, jacked it up, took the wheel off, looked aimlessly for a few minutes and had a beer instead :facepalm:

RE other updates, it's throwing engine codes. I'd bought a Vag Com cable off ebay, and in my haste didn't realise they only worked on Windows XP systems, who the hell still runs XP?? Anyway, going to try load a copy of XP as a virtual drive today to see if it'll work. Again, the seller has been very good in his communication, I hadn't read all the details to see it was for XP, though all the non-genuine cables seem to be XP. As for the code, I'm not sure yet, still drives fine. I threw a code when I picked up it which Gav cleared, was something like an "02 sensor slow to react".

I'm also looking at quieting the exhaust, around town its fine (pretty fricken cool actually, what a ball tearer), but on the highway it drones, in all honesty I wear earplugs, lol. I'm sure my body age is twice my real age. Open to input on ideas RE the exhaust drone at highway speeds, other environments is fine. I want to head to wakefield in a few months, but 1100kms with the drone... :behead:

I haven't done any form of timed runs yet, probably done barely 3-400kms in the car. Trying to get to a dyno day in the next few weeks, perhaps try drags when some mates head out - though have low expectations of myself. Will get some km's once the above stuff is sorted. Happy laps on the 12th, if all goes well, Lakeside timeattack on 20th for a more serious shakedown. Will still run the federal 595 tyres.

[VWindahouse]

Nice update mate, i'm sure those H&R's will be nicer than the FK's which had to be wound down to the floor to get any dampening happening. I'm wondering the if the code is due to the entire downpipe being coated with the ceramic stuff. it's cool to touch in summer months so winter might get very cool indeed and I remember Gav saying the O2 sensors need a lot of heat to work. Just a stab in the dark.

For the drone - because the wheel well is empty the sound bounces around in there pretty bad because the rear muffler is now positioned right up against it, so a movers blanket or two will fix that back yard mechanic style :) Also if you still have your parcel shelf from the silver Polo that helps too. I love my music so never bothered me tbh.

Best of luck with the drags and sprints coming up! And hopefully you'll see a few more killerwasps with the new exhaust at the JBS dyno day ;)

[seangti]

Nice update mate, i'm sure those H&R's will be nicer than the FK's which had to be wound down to the floor to get any dampening happening. I'm wondering the if the code is due to the entire downpipe being coated with the ceramic stuff. it's cool to touch in summer months so winter might get very cool indeed and I remember Gav saying the O2 sensors need a lot of heat to work. Just a stab in the dark.

For the drone - because the wheel well is empty the sound bounces around in there pretty bad because the rear muffler is now positioned right up against it, so a movers blanket or two will fix that back yard mechanic style :) Also if you still have your parcel shelf from the silver Polo that helps too. I love my music so never bothered me tbh.

Best of luck with the drags and sprints coming up! And hopefully you'll see a few more killerwasps with the new exhaust at the JBS dyno day ;)

Ahh yes, very good points. Perhaps best to add sound deadening to the wheel well... I like that idea more than quietening the exhaust :-) Will go buy some today.

And also for the 02 sensor, cheers for the input. Both times it's come on has been off a cold engine and seems logical. It won't bother me if that's the case, knowledge is power and all that.

As always, thanks for the input.

[h100vw]

Ahh yes, very good points. Perhaps best to add sound deadening to the wheel well... I like that idea more than quietening the exhaust :-) Will go buy some today.

And also for the 02 sensor, cheers for the input. Both times it's come on has been off a cold engine and seems logical. It won't bother me if that's the case, knowledge is power and all that.

As always, thanks for the input.

I am available at the airport today Sean, if you want to chance a ride to the Northside! :cookie:

Gavin

[Jmac]

Ceramic exhaust would have no bearing on the o2 faults whatsoever. Good to see you having fun with it.

[h100vw]

I got a new probe off Jimmy, for my slow to react one.

They do need heat in them and have electric heaters, which the ECU can monitor for failures. I'd expect the coating to keep the heat in the pipe but maybe the large diameter has some influence on the temps?

Gavin

[Jmac]

I really doubt it mate the heater element brings them up to temp quick so the system goes into closed loop, the sensor doesn't work on heat, I very much doubt this is the cause. Yes they need heat but almost certain this will not be the cause only a failing 02 sensor in my opinion.
Jmac

[rgvlee]

The O2 sensors do have a limited lifespan as well...

[Jmac]

^^ Yes they do, agree mate. Ive fitted a few ceramic coated exhausts with no dramas with O2, im certain its the sensor alone and nothing else. Interestingly the service books in Skodas now have a provision for a tick as a service item. Go Skoda!!!

[h100vw]

^^ Yes they do, agree mate. Ive fitted a few ceramic coated exhausts with no dramas with O2, im certain its the sensor alone and nothing else. Interestingly the service books in Skodas now have a provision for a tick as a service item. Go Skoda!!!

What does the tick mean Jimmy, they have looked at it or checked it's working?

Gavin

[Jmac]

Change it

[h100vw]

Change it

Wow, obviously going to be cheaper for the punter than a breakdown. What distance is that at?

Gavin

[Jmac]

Should be in every service book imo, its 100k. I remember back in the day we did coolant temp sensors with the service, not sure why we don't now, for all they cost. Mind you they were more accessible then, new stuff can be fun.
Im sure the plastics were better then, you need the steady hand of a surgeon these days even just pulling out the dipstick to check your oil can cost you in a swag of plastic

[seangti]

All good input on the 02 sensor, cheers for sharing.

Found time for some timed runs using GTech Fanatic RR gps.
3x 0-100kph runs with traction control were 6.55-6.7s. So very consistent. 1x run without TC was 6.08s. With a little practice I'm sure consistent sub-6's are reasonable. Plus the road surface was dusty, lightly pebbled where I launched.

Did 1x quarter mile, was a 6.55 to 100kph with a 14.6s run, can't recall trap speed, can share that later if anyone is interested. I was reasonably gentle between gears, so am confident on a good surface, non-TC launch I'll be into 13's without my drama and some practice. This is the first quarter mile I've even run. Never tried it in the silver car or any other.

Did 1x 100kph-0, stopped in 37m flat. Would be good to have done some successive stops to see if that improved as brake temp increased. This was on reasonably cold rotors after heading down the highway. In comparison to standard rotors, I recall getting a best of ~36m in my silver car, but took 3 stops to achieve, with a cold pad stop of ~42m. Eitherway, pedal feel between the two is chalk and cheese. Even with all new stuff on the silver car, the standard gear lacks bite and some feel, but no probs stopping.

80-120kph in gear acceleration
3rd gear - 3.3s
4th gear - 3.6s
5th gear - 5.2s

100-150
4th gear : 5.0s :P

Power delivery characteristics were surprising similar to my lightly modded silver car. Interesting, the difference between stretching 3rd or short shifting 4th makes little difference. Upshifting 3rd to 4th at anywhere between 110kph and 140kph makes next to no difference. I'd stretch it on a sprint/time attack, but general blasting I'd be short shifting. I can share the graphs later. 3rd and 4th must be reasonably close gears, as 2nd requires all revs to reachs it's ideal shift point to 3rd and is quite a narrow window- not that it matters with the power...

The H&R's will be in late next week, very excited to get that sorted. Will also be very interesting to run these things again to see how acceleration and braking are affected.

Geez I love this data stuff :cookie:

[seangti]

Installed the H&R coilovers over the past 2 days. Straight forward job except the Kmac adjustable camber and castor tops wouldn't fit the H&R springs. Had to resort to putting in new standard VW strut tops and bearings. Not biggy.

As for the H&R's, absolutely chuffed. Huge improvement in every aspect, have only putted around suburbia this afternoon and much nicer. They are firmer than the H&R spring with bilstein strut that I have in my silver car, so am happy with that too. Perhaps if coming from standard suspension to this you may find em too firm. These ones are the 20-50mm lower coilover, you can get one that drops up to 80mm. Perhaps on reflection I'd go the lower coilover. I'll wait for it to settle to see what height I can get it too, but I'd say it'll be no lower than the H&R's springs of the other car. At the moment, it's about one inch higher than it was with the FK's. Have also reinstalled the front chassis brace which had to come off for the road worthy due to ride height.

The FK's will be binned, I won't try give em away. The dampers are mostly shagged, with no rebound once compressed.

Only a couple of things left to do before I'm "done", need to replace the o2 sensor and realised today the reverse light is red and rear fog light is white, lol, so will swap em over to ensure its legal.

The next couple of weeks will test it's newfound ability. Try my hand at drags this week, happy laps next weekend for a shake down and timeattack the following weekend.

I'm hoping/expecting a similar lap time to my silver car which ran semi-slicks as I'm likely to be running the current 595's at timeattack. I don't think the audi TT rims will fit over the brembo calipers...

[jasn78]

The next couple of weeks will test it's newfound ability. Try my hand at drags this week

And this makes me happy :) Good choice of nights to do it as well Sean.

[VWindahouse]

Great update Sean :)

for the strut tops give Kevin at KMac a call and let him know and he will probably just ask you to send him the alloy hats and he will have a new set made to accommodate the H&R's. He's a top bloke to deal with!

[seangti]

Great update Sean :)

for the strut tops give Kevin at KMac a call and let him know and he will probably just ask you to send him the alloy hats and he will have a new set made to accommodate the H&R's. He's a top bloke to deal with!

Thanks mate. I had trawled your thread and was going to look into that. Am impatient and have a busy few weeks at the tracks ahead :-)

If interested, you're welcome to have a spin with the new suspension. Any time hey

[grandturismo]

Pics of stance now please

[seangti]

Pics of stance now please

No, I'm embarrassed. :emo_baghead:

Ok, will do so in the next few days when I see the car in day light. I haven't taken pics yet.

[team_v]

No, I'm embarrassed. :emo_baghead:

Ok, will do so in the next few days when I see the car in day light. I haven't taken pics yet.

No doubt we will have some pictures at Happy Laps :)

[seangti]

http://i1271.photobucket.com/albums/jj623/seangt83/E9A2C8C3-D6FC-4256-8C2A-D29F78390EC7_zpsxrfcqhm8.jpg (http://s1271.photobucket.com/user/seangt83/media/E9A2C8C3-D6FC-4256-8C2A-D29F78390EC7_zpsxrfcqhm8.jpg.html)

http://www.vwwatercooled.com.au/forums/images/imported/2014/07/C92B4D476C45484FA48FDA1E50688026_zpsi9xa-1.jpg (http://s1271.photobucket.com/user/seangt83/media/C92B4D47-6C45-484F-A48F-DA1E50688026_zpsi9xagipr.jpg.html)

http://www.vwwatercooled.com.au/forums/images/imported/2014/07/EC72963A5E6246C791075289E29BE0D7_zpseqgn-1.jpg (http://s1271.photobucket.com/user/seangt83/media/EC72963A-5E62-46C7-9107-5289E29BE0D7_zpseqgn91uc.jpg.html)

http://www.vwwatercooled.com.au/forums/images/imported/2014/07/AB91BBC166F042D8A2AF5D44D0EC6187_zpsvymi-1.jpg (http://s1271.photobucket.com/user/seangt83/media/AB91BBC1-66F0-42D8-A2AF-5D44D0EC6187_zpsvymiefob.jpg.html)

[Paazuzu]

Looks awesome! :cool:

[jasn78]

Sean how did last night go??

[seangti]

Sean how did last night go??

haha, damn, knew I shouldn't have mentioned it.

Nah, I suck, can't drive in a straight. Best was the first run of the night that I bogged the launch, had a second dig of the clutch and got a 14.308 @ 166kph. My 60ft times were all awful at 2.5-2.6sec, worse of 2.659. I had 5 runs, slowest was a 14.5, with a best 60ft at 2.45sec... so not good. I felt I had good traction in 2nd gear, but obviosuly not so. I ignored the lights going out, so reaction time was like 1sec, so cant' blame rushing it either.

Given I had little expectations of myself, I have little to be disappointed about. I did enjoy it more than I expected to. Certainly appreciate the difficulty in getting the car off the line, god knows how you and Anthony did that so much cleaner than I could achieve. Perhaps should have done burnouts at the start to get tyre temp :P

[jasn78]

Dont worry about burnouts mate

[vwthunder]

Found one of my old time slips

14.303@104.21 which is 167.7kph 60ft was 2.38

Oh that was spinning one wheel all the way through 2nd up to about 100kph

Im sure your car has a lot more potential

I find the more power in my polo the slower i go due to traction :facepalm:

[Lito]

Found one of my old time slips

14.303@104.21 which is 167.7kph 60ft was 2.38

Oh that was spinning one wheel all the way through 2nd up to about 100kph

Im sure your car has a lot more potential

I find the more power in my polo the slower i go due to traction :facepalm:

A diff would fix that :D

[seangti]

A diff would fix that :D

Group buy on LSD's?? :P

I've got happy laps this weekend and planning for timeattack the following, depending on how that goes I'll potentially pull some power (timing) from it for the time being and look at LSD options, or just settle with less power. Have only been able to find Guy Harding with an idea about LSD's and the polo's, though he recommends a plate style diff which is around the $4k. I'm aware of the draw backs of the others, though comfortable a wavetrac (or similar) will suffice, but yet to price it.

Interestingly, my speed at the 1/8mile was marginally higher than cars running mid 13's. eg. Golf R ran a 13.9s @ 171kph, 122kph at 1/8, I ran a 14.495 @ 163kph, and 130 at 1/8. Another run, Golf R did a 13.7 @ 170kph, at 1/8 he was travelling 128kph, I did the 14.3 @ 166kph, but was travel 132kph at 1/8. The Golf R was manual. Perhaps I'm just really bad at launching it cos once it's going, it really goes.

[jasn78]

Sean it is all in the launch
The way I did it and this is why you cannot run a standard clutch for drags.
1. Dial in about 1800rpm
2. Engage hand brake
3. Release clutch till bites
4. At the same point release hand brake
5. Balance throttle clutcj amd hand brake against each other to avoid wheel spin in first 60 feet.
6. Dont rev out to anythi g over 6 grand on gear changes

[VWindahouse]

haha, damn, knew I shouldn't have mentioned it.

Nah, I suck, can't drive in a straight. Best was the first run of the night that I bogged the launch, had a second dig of the clutch and got a 14.308 @ 166kph. My 60ft times were all awful at 2.5-2.6sec, worse of 2.659. I had 5 runs, slowest was a 14.5, with a best 60ft at 2.45sec... so not good. I felt I had good traction in 2nd gear, but obviosuly not so. I ignored the lights going out, so reaction time was like 1sec, so cant' blame rushing it either.

Given I had little expectations of myself, I have little to be disappointed about. I did enjoy it more than I expected to. Certainly appreciate the difficulty in getting the car off the line, god knows how you and Anthony did that so much cleaner than I could achieve. Perhaps should have done burnouts at the start to get tyre temp :P

Nice work mate, great 1st effort! Especially considering you've only had the car for a couple of months v's my 7 years of getting used to the set up :)

Just wondering what tyre pressures you ran with?

[VWindahouse]

PS has the rattle gone from the front right with the HR's?

[seangti]

Nice work mate, great 1st effort! Especially considering you've only had the car for a couple of months v's my 7 years of getting used to the set up :)

Just wondering what tyre pressures you ran with?

Cheers bud. Ran 30psi.

Also just got back from happy laps, I am very happy with the suspension, car balance is really good. Very stable at speed and adjustable mid corner. Running front sway bar on soft and rear medium. Could go hard on the rear for track work to get marginally better front end turn. The rear was very stable through the kink at pace, must be wing Ant. :-)

Blew off the intercooler pipe, again, but got 20mins before that happened, though wasn't driving the car as hard as the few laps at QR. Back to the drawing board for the IC piping... perhaps high temp glue and double jubilee clip, or replace the lower plastic pipe with a stainless steel one. I'm open to anyones experience on this issue.

[seangti]

PS has the rattle gone from the front right with the HR's?

Yup, no rattles from suspension anymore. No idea if it was the FK's or Kmac's rattling, at a guess I'd say Kmac's.

[vwthunder]

Yup, no rattles from suspension anymore. No idea if it was the FK's or Kmac's rattling, at a guess I'd say Kmac's.

So i guess i should take my strut tops out and re-install

[seangti]

Any tips on where and how to mount a fire extinguisher? I need to be able to reach it easily, though don't want to hack up anything, or anything that at least can't be changed/covered in the future.

Cleaned out the intercooler pipe that has been popping off, had some oil residue around the male part so have cleaned that with petrol and reinstalled. Will check it after each session on Sunday and see how it goes. I have a feeling it's moreso caused by the rubber pipe coming from the turbo, once it gets hot is further softened... will be a PITA to have to replace that though will keep an eye on it.

It pops at the end where my hand is.
http://www.vwwatercooled.com.au/forums/images/imported/2014/07/8F57E4D4063C45A79A8EB25E3277A8D2_zpsknjd-1.jpg (http://s1271.photobucket.com/user/seangt83/media/8F57E4D4-063C-45A7-9A8E-B25E3277A8D2_zpsknjdavvd.jpg.html)

[rgvlee]

I've seen guys get a plate laser cut, mount under the passenger seat rail then mount the fire extinguisher to that. Looks tidy. Need a thick plate to meet regs.

[seangti]

I've seen guys get a plate laser cut, mount under the passenger seat rail then mount the fire extinguisher to that. Looks tidy. Need a thick plate to meet regs.

Solid option, cheers. Will look into how that'd mount.

[kaanage]

I mounted a 2mm thick aluminium bar, bent into to line fairly closely with the floor contour, using the passenger front rail bolts and this has 2 6mm holes in it which I used to bolt in a piece of right angle aluminium which has the extinguisher bracket mounted to it.

That way, the bar under seat stays installed and doesn't interfere with the seat or drawer but the rest is easily removable for daily use.

I'll try to get a picture of it up.


Running front sway bar on soft and rear medium. Could go hard on the rear for track work to get marginally better front end turn. The rear was very stable through the kink at pace, must be wing Ant. :-)
I've actually found stability under (heavy) brakes to be the bigger issue than mid corner so long as I don't pike out and lift off after turn in.

[Eddy]

Hoyhoy.

That plastic pipe will always cause problems, the rubber ones are O.K.
I had a stainless steel replacement made & then use T-Clamps everywhere.
Haven't had a popped hose for several years now, after many went on me.

http://www.vwwatercooled.com.au/forums/images/imported/2014/07/00830_zpsba4e9d60-1.jpg (http://s184.photobucket.com/user/eddy13_photos/media/00830_zpsba4e9d60.jpg.html)

[Eddy]

Hoyhoy.

My fire extinguisher set-up was fairly easy after a lot of procrastinating.

http://www.vwwatercooled.com.au/forums/images/imported/2014/07/002_zpsc8aaeb6d-1.jpg (http://s184.photobucket.com/user/eddy13_photos/media/002_zpsc8aaeb6d.jpg.html)

http://www.vwwatercooled.com.au/forums/images/imported/2014/07/003_zps8ff0218e-1.jpg (http://s184.photobucket.com/user/eddy13_photos/media/003_zps8ff0218e.jpg.html)

[seangti]

Thanks guys. Eddy, I'm liking the pipework there. Might need to be friendly with some fabricators. Eddy, the fire extinguisher, is that just screwed into the floor? Isn't the fuel tank tucked under there? Will see if I can do something around the front passenger seat.

Just had a short drive to check the IC piping and drove over some metal on the road I didn't see, it got caught between the inside of the front wheel and caliper, hacked up both a bit. Pee'd off.

[Eddy]

Thanks guys. Eddy, I'm liking the pipework there. Might need to be friendly with some fabricators. Eddy, the fire extinguisher, is that just screwed into the floor? Isn't the fuel tank tucked under there?

Hoyhoy.
That bit of pipe work cost me a fair bit.
As to the fire extinguisher its no where near the fuel tank & is screwed through the floor.

[seangti]

Another day at the track, another set of drama's. But the intercooler pipe stayed, for the 2 sessions (10 laps) I got. Still had a much better day than the driver of this Evo. He was uninjured, but the cars fate is self explanatory. Poor fellow.

http://www.vwwatercooled.com.au/forums/images/imported/2014/07/779AC7CA268E4A169F768793E04AB939_zps7m0t-1.jpg (http://s1271.photobucket.com/user/seangt83/media/779AC7CA-268E-4A16-9F76-8793E04AB939_zps7m0t8dqw.jpg.html)

http://www.vwwatercooled.com.au/forums/images/imported/2014/07/62705E8CAA534F7C83F3D78644066485_zps7vu8-1.jpg (http://s1271.photobucket.com/user/seangt83/media/62705E8C-AA53-4F7C-83F3-D78644066485_zps7vu860wf.jpg.html)

http://www.vwwatercooled.com.au/forums/images/imported/2014/07/A0588BAB995F42E488EB9057C5290DFB_zpskxjm-1.jpg (http://s1271.photobucket.com/user/seangt83/media/A0588BAB-995F-42E4-88EB-9057C5290DFB_zpskxjmahig.jpg.html)


As for my day, 2 sessions, got a best of 64.4 seconds, so am happy with that. There's a 63sec lap in it, just need more laps to build up to it. Having seen the above drivers accident that was in my mind. But as for pace, braking and handling, I was absolutely chuffed, what a weapon to tame. I was running semi slicks which just got better with heat. The car is also more streetable with the audi TT rims, being a heavier rim it's not as peeky in first and second gear.

As for drama's, seem to have blown an exhaust/turbo gasket, unfortunate. But of greater hassle is I lost power steering and perhaps a few other bits. Gavin was close by and very generously offered assistance, it could be a few things on the car, the MAP sensor is not reading anything (zero current and flow reading), said power steering loss and traction control light is jammed on. Gavin has provided a wiring diagram for some fault finding so will deal with that over the coming weeks. It seems out of my depth at the moment.

[Eddy]

Hoyhoy.

Seeing these pics. remind me as to why I travel to Wakefield Park for fun.
The big kids save track.

[Jmac]

wiring diagrams my favourite pastime. :)

[seangti]

I had 10mins of initiative this afternoon and constructed the fire extinguisher holder. Was very simple as I had the parts laying around, just a little drilling for the bracket. The car is with Jimmy at the moment getting fixed so have trial fitted to the daily. I'll bolt it down to the seat rails and floor when it goes into the correct car, though will have it removable for daily use. As it is, the seat couldn't be moved which I don't see an issue with. Chuffed.

http://www.vwwatercooled.com.au/forums/images/imported/2014/08/IMG_1721_zps6213bf24-1.jpg (http://s1271.photobucket.com/user/seangt83/media/IMG_1721_zps6213bf24.jpg.html)

[Paazuzu]

Nice one. Let's hope you never have to use it!! :)

[39erman]

Hi Sean,

When were you planning to go to Wakefield Park, I'd like to come out and kick the tyres if you don't mind????

Paul....

[seangti]

Hi Sean,

When were you planning to go to Wakefield Park, I'd like to come out and kick the tyres if you don't mind????

Paul....

Hi, I'm optimistically looking at October/November now, but realistically it probably won't be this year. I've had a few reliability issues so need to get them sorted and regain the confidence that'll it make the round trip. Probably won't have car back till next week.


The electrical issue mentioned above was the oil sensor wiring sheathing having melted and shorted out. The exhaust leak was the turbo bolts having come lose. Still need to change the exhaust 02 sensor and sort out the intercooler piping from popping off. I think I'd damaged the plastic pipe by over tightening, but also think one of the silicon hoses may have been a little short which changed the angle of the hardened plastic pipe entering the rubber pipe from the turbo. At least when comparing to my silver car the hardened plastic pipe is sitting at a greater angle on the red car, rather than square.

Whilst I've had some reliability issues, i'm in no way disappointed or PO'd about having bought the car. When driving on the track everything is pushed very hard, beyond that which can be replicated on the street, in absolute fairness I had anticipated some issues and budgeted for that. I guess I just wanted to reiterate that point.

With regards to the melted sheathing, I believe that's due to how close the wiring runs to the turbo. It's also an 8yr old car so 5hit gets brittle. JMac is sorting this out by glass wrapping it (whatever that means :-)) and I've been trying to reach Mark from billet turbo's to discuss heat management.

Should get the car back next week in time to try happy laps the following week. Next timeattack will be October.

[h100vw]

I think I replaced the 90 degree bend off the last VW pipe by the sump on my car with an aluminium one Sean. Maybe that would work for you?

The split tube doesn't seem to last well on those wires, mine had fallen to bits and I replaced it with some split sleeve from Jaycar. I left some a Jimmys on monday, not sure if he felt like using it, fibreglass tape would be more robust.

The downpipe and cast section of the turbo are both ceramic coated, so think the only other thing you might do, is some shielding and maybe duct some cold air past it from the grille? Or Eddy's bonnet scoops?

Gavin

[seangti]

I think I replaced the 90 degree bend off the last VW pipe by the sump on my car with an aluminium one Sean. Maybe that would work for you?


ahhh, that could be the picture I recall seeing in Anthony's thread with an aluminium pipe. I'd saved the picture on the home computer and was looking it earlier in the week, scratching my head as to where it was as that pipe didn't exist on the car... it's probably your car. haha. Pic also shows an ECS lower pulley. Jimmy was looking into a resolve, but that's the way I'll head if Jimmy doesn't sort it first.

Re air flow, a 3d printer would come in handy hey. No more scoops to be added :-)

Thanks mate.

[grandturismo]

Loving your attitude Sean.
Racing always seems to bring some issues but I'm sure you'll make this little Polo bullet proof. Look forward to catching up soon.

[kaanage]

I had 10mins of initiative this afternoon and constructed the fire extinguisher holder.

I finally found the old pic I had put up for my brackets. It's not the clearest (really crap phone camera back then) but you should get the idea

http://www.vwwatercooled.com.au/forums/images/imported/2011/10/extingJPG-1.jpg

[seangti]

Time for an update, I got the car back earlier in the week after a few weeks of TLC, Jmac style. Had a few things to fix up from my last track outing. Done about 200kms over the weekend, in lots of rain yesterday, wet happy laps at lakeside, highway and suburbia run around today, all is sweet. Had the pre-cat 02 sensor replaced, intercooler piping which was blowing off has been re-fabricated and turbo bolts done for the meantime till some different ones arrive.

Car feels less like a light switch coming on boost, so more drive-able lower in the rev range. Also had Gavin remove some boost before hitting the track yesterday, I didn't have the gauge connected yeserday, but today looks to be about 18psi in the very brief squirt I gave it. The idea of removing some boost is in the hope of making it a little more friendly on the race track so I can carry heavier throttle in 4th gear through the back of lakeside and minimise some tyre spin. Next track outing will be mid October.

Thanks again to Jimmy for your work, I don't know most of what you did, but happy you did :-)

Gav, re Unitronic software, I have the new USB drivers but they weren't playing nicely to load on my computer. Will keep trying. Thanks for helping.

Some awesome pics were taken yesterday, all credit of the pics to forum member sandwg, Alex. I zoomed in the pics which unintentionally removed his watermark of Ale Renda.

http://www.vwwatercooled.com.au/forums/images/imported/2014/08/HL_230814_02_zps94dccb1f-1.jpg (http://s1271.photobucket.com/user/seangt83/media/HL_230814_02_zps94dccb1f.jpg.html)

http://www.vwwatercooled.com.au/forums/images/imported/2014/08/HL_230814_01_zpsca517031-1.jpg (http://s1271.photobucket.com/user/seangt83/media/HL_230814_01_zpsca517031.jpg.html)

http://www.vwwatercooled.com.au/forums/images/imported/2014/08/HL_230814_03a_zps80fa135b-1.jpg (http://s1271.photobucket.com/user/seangt83/media/HL_230814_03a_zps80fa135b.jpg.html)

http://www.vwwatercooled.com.au/forums/images/imported/2014/08/HL_230814_04_zpsecc76d83-1.jpg (http://s1271.photobucket.com/user/seangt83/media/HL_230814_04_zpsecc76d83.jpg.html)
Not sure who took this pic, cheers to this person too.

And lastly, the only pic with the TT rims, which I quite like on the car.
http://i1271.photobucket.com/albums/jj623/seangt83/IMG_1749v2_zpsee60b5c6.jpg (http://s1271.photobucket.com/user/seangt83/media/IMG_1749v2_zpsee60b5c6.jpg.html)

[Paazuzu]

The second pic is the best from the day - car looks ballistic! :)


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[seangti]

Hi, I'm seeking input on wheel alignment settings. The car has tracked to the left marginally since I got it, I replaced the suspension and got a wheel alignment yet still tracks left. It's more a disconcerting feeling as it lacks consistent feel. I called the suspension mob back to seek clarification and they tell me it's due to the castor not being equal and non adjustable. I have Superpro lower control arm bushes.

The alignment settings:
Front
Castor in degree: 4.28 (L), 4.78 (R)
Camber in degree: -0.91 (L), -0.76 (R)
Toe: 0.1mm (L), 0.1mm (R)

Pre alignment toe was -3.5mm (L) and -3.7mm (R), all other angles had essentially no change.

What's people thoughts on this castor comment,
- is 0.4 deg enough to cause the car to veer left?
- Are control arm bushes left or right hand side oriented... could they have been installed wrong way way or something (I've never heard of this in the 6+yrs I've been learning about these cars).
- Can/Should I correct the veering by compensating with the toe angles?
- Take the car elsewhere?
They knew the car is predominantly track oriented and cautioned about toe angles being beyond straight ahead.

My silver car has very good steering feel but have been unable to find previous alignment details as comparison.

[h100vw]

I reckon those Superpro bushes are adjustable. However, it needs setting as you fit the bush. No idea how you'd manage to do that. I installed them by eye, with them in the neutral position. Adjusting them would be pretty hard graft to get it equal on both sides.

They aren't handed, you can rotate them to any position. I was just looking for the install instructions on line but couldn't.

I just got another set in the back of my S3, I'll have to open them up later to look.

Gavin

[nat225]

Does it have a front subframe (like mk5/6 platform)? Previously i was also having similar issue and the castor was different by much left and right, possibly due to incorrect whiteline alk and subframe alignment.

The caster was different by .5 degree and it was enough to veer the car to the left, until Heasman steering did something with the car alignment to compensate the caster diff.

Now with superpro lca and alk bits installed by Jmac (i was very impressed), the caster left and right are almost similar.

[vwthunder]

Are you going to get the Kmac Camber/Castor strut tops back in ?

Trying to find one of my alignments

[Stuwey]

I'd find another wheel aligner, who doesn't just go 'by the numbers'. Mine is currently set number-perfect on a newer machine. Turns nice, but drives a bit weird on the streets.

Another place that i've had do mine has spent about two hours doing it, on the old repco-style swivel plates. No computers. About 15 individual laps around the block. It points sharp and feels very positive on the street, too. Just need to get a day off work so i can go back :(

How is the rear alignment? I had 11mm of total rear toe - 5mm on one side and 6mm on the other. Now adjusted to 2 and 3 respectively, and is WAY happier to turn-in.

Time to find some old bloke who knows what's going on, not some kid at a tyre shop.

[nat225]

Heasmans also fixed mine using swivel plate / ruler equipments. No computer involved, just pure skills and expertise.

[seangti]

Thanks for the input guys. The subframe could make sense so will explore.

Nat, where is Heasmans? I can only find details for them in sydney.

Troy, the plan is to reinstall the Kmac's, perhaps will happen sooner as a strut top bearing on the silver car is clunking. I'm yet to contact Kmac for the suspension tops.

Stuwey - you're exactly right about them going purely by numbers. The guy road tested it, gave the keys back and said it steers to the left. I asked him to clarify before I left and he blamed potentially worn engine mounts and control arm bushes - which is BS as they are all near on brand new.

The rear has the whiteline shims which change the toe by 3mm. I'd have to look at the figures again, at face value it seemed ok.

[39erman]

I'm involved with a dedicated track car and we have heaps of problems getting a correct wheel alignment done by tyre shops and the like.

Now we only use dedicated motorsports people like VSports here in Sydney who do the whole alignment including alignment, ride height and corner weighting. Makes a HUGE difference to the way the car handles, brakes and wears its tyres.

Spend some time and seek them out in your city, but you wont get this type of setup for $100. You pay for what you get.....

[Jmac]

Cant agree more here . Spent Yrs during my app doing quattros etc and took hrs, not toe and go $100 would get you nothing. Its specialised man, cant stress it enough.

[grandturismo]

Go see Ken @ Accurate Suspension.

[39erman]

Yes, and I cannot stress enough that getting the correct ride height AND corner weighting WILL balance the car better = better lap times.

You will then be able to play with tyre pressures more accurately. R spec tyres DO NOT like to be over pressured and I have not seen any that run more than 36-38 psi HOT. As mentioned previously, just ask the tyre dealers out at the track, their more than willing to help even if your not a customer....

[seangti]

Yes, and I cannot stress enough that getting the correct ride height AND corner weighting WILL balance the car better = better lap times.

You will then be able to play with tyre pressures more accurately. R spec tyres DO NOT like to be over pressured and I have not seen any that run more than 36-38 psi HOT. As mentioned previously, just ask the tyre dealers out at the track, their more than willing to help even if your not a customer....

Thanks for your input. I'll go see Accurate Suspension today, Ken is renowned for his work, so good place to start for my humble ambitions.

I took the alignment sheet to another tyre place who've done a good job on my other car, they said the settings look all good and the aligner previously worked for them and they rate his knowledge highly. Could be a corner weighting issue, I know it's not sitting perfect atm.

[39erman]

Could be a corner weighting issue, I know it's not sitting perfect atm.

Corner weighting is not hard as long as you have adjustable spring platforms on all corners of the car. If not it can be quite time consuming. You can do some pre height adjustments at home by deciding on your preferred ride height and using a rule or tape measure from the same spot on each corner of the car. Try to do this on a relatively flat surface otherwise you'll just end up jacking up on corner more than another. With this done it will change all your previous wheel alignment settings so then it's off to the wheel aligner.

Also, if you have stabliser bars, make sure than when the car is at its preferred ride height that none of the uprights/links are tight or binding as this will corner jack the car and transfer load to the opposite side. You should be able to discount the upright/links freely when the car is fully wheel aligned/corner weighted.

Then go out and enjoy....

[seangti]

I've decided to book the car in with Accurate Suspension for next week. They're also going to fit the Kmac adjustable strut tops so will dial in some camber and castor, along with corner weighting. As I still want to drive the car on the street I'll probably go with -2 to -2.5 deg camber. They aren't hugely fond of the Kmac gear, but for the polo there is little option.

Bring on timeattack in October, champing to get out there and give it a hot go.

[vwthunder]

I am running full negative camber which is around -3 or more for street, im going to get another alignment done soon, will be interesting to compare notes

Do you know how much corner weighting is ?

[seangti]

I am running full negative camber which is around -3 or more for street, im going to get another alignment done soon, will be interesting to compare notes

Do you know how much corner weighting is ?
Not actually sure on price, I didn't ask... a mate had his set-up done for $350, which was alignment, height, weighting and dampening I believe.

[h100vw]

Not actually sure on price, I didn't ask... a mate had his set-up done for $350, which was alignment, height, weighting and dampening I believe.

Will you strip it out for the corner weighting?

Gavin

[team_v]

Will you strip it out for the corner weighting?

Gavin

Would you need to allow for extra driver weight when setting it up as well?
I.e. setting up the car empty would be great but then you add an extra 70-80kg of driver which can throw off the balance somewhat.

[vwthunder]

I know a place here in Melbourne that hires out the scales

I might do DIY :P

[seangti]

Sorry for the delay, I'm on holiday :-) I've pulled out the rear seats so it's close to track weight. They were actually lighter than I'd expected. Have left the seat base as that's just foam, and I didn't have time before going away and get back tomorrow night to drop the car off Monday morning.

I'll ask about driver weight when I drop the car off and see what he thinks. I'm dubious as to how much effect this would have for the average punter, it all counts but whether it's tangible to lap times. Will be interesting to get the corner weight measurements and corner heights to better understand the dynamics.

Troy, I was going to DIY, but after reading up further on it, along with being time poor, it'd be best to know how much one turn corresponds to weight movement. So lots of jacking up, turning, dropping, measuring. A professional with the right tools and knowledge will do it in a fraction of the time while I can relax, and know its done right.

[39erman]

I am running full negative camber which is around -3 or more for street, im going to get another alignment done soon, will be interesting to compare notes

Do you know how much corner weighting is ?

I pay $300 to have the car corner weighted, ride height adjustment & wheel aligned. We drop the car off and pick it up later in the day.

Remember that castor is as important as camber. Can toe out and -ve camber be achieved in the rear thru bushings?

[39erman]

Would you need to allow for extra driver weight when setting it up as well?
I.e. setting up the car empty would be great but then you add an extra 70-80kg of driver which can throw off the balance somewhat.

Absolutely. Like the stablisers, you dont want to load the car up with the driver AFTER you've done your setup...

[seangti]

Can toe out and -ve camber be achieved in the rear thru bushings?

Yes, can be done with some whiteline shims. The car has them though I believe it's toe only, though they could have camber adjustment but I don't think so.

[seangti]

oki doki, the car as been sorted. Kmac tops are in. -2.6 degrees on left, -2.2deg on right. All my local tracks are right handers, so makes sense. I forgot to ask about the castor. The car now drives straight, so better than before. The Kmac tops will make some noises kind of like the spring binding as they don't have bearings in them like the factory stuff.

The car now has a 65/35 (f/r) balance. Ride height looks a little funny with a higher rear to front. Though looks comes second to handling. Have only driven straight down the highway to work so no idea how it'll behave. Will keep that for the race track.

Now that's pretty much everything I wanted to sort on the car at the moment, it's running well, the exhaust seems to have quietened down to a reasonable level since Jimmy had it, perhaps the loose turbo bolts or flange had something to do with that. I have looked into changing the rear muffler over, though allowing for it be interchanged, so quiet muffler for road and swap it to the current free flowing one when at the track. I'm now happy and amping to get to the track and drive it like it's been built to be :banana:

[team_v]

Glad it's all starting to get sorted out.
When is the next track outting?

[seangti]

Glad it's all starting to get sorted out.
When is the next track outting?

Timeattack at Lakeside on 11th October.

[39erman]

The Kmac tops will make some noises kind of like the spring binding as they don't have bearings in them like the factory stuff.

The car now has a 65/35 (f/r) balance. Ride height looks a little funny with a higher rear to front. Though looks comes second to handling.

:banana:

Rake, it's called rake. Most race cars have rake except maybe F1 and some cars where the rear can't have a decent ride height due to geometry problems from the manufacturer. Rake aids in aerodynamics to create more down force at the front.

To keep your settings avoid pot holes, gutters and general wheel banging as this will change the geometry setup when travelling to and from events.

The springs should not rattle around. The camber tops will hold the spring in place by either a poly style bushing or a spring top retainer. Make sure that the shocks shaft is done up all the way and that the shock shaft nut does not protrude away from the base of the camber top when the wheel is on the ground. If it does, simply pack it up with washers under the camber tops, this is a normal practice.

Now enjoy and play with those tyre pressures. Ask your tyre supplier about starting pressures....

[seangti]

The springs should not rattle around. The camber tops will hold the spring in place by either a poly style bushing or a spring top retainer. Make sure that the shocks shaft is done up all the way and that the shock shaft nut does not protrude away from the base of the camber top when the wheel is on the ground. If it does, simply pack it up with washers under the camber tops, this is a normal practice.

Now enjoy and play with those tyre pressures. Ask your tyre supplier about starting pressures....

Thanks again, always welcome input.

I could have better explained the kmac tops. Whereas the factory tops have the strut top bearing to allow the spring to rotate against the mount, the kmacs don't use a bearing or poly bush. It's a metal to metal contact which allows for rotation in a pillow ball joint arrangement, inherit in it's design makes some binding like noise at that point. It's not the spring to mount binding noise. It's not an issue, Ken at Accurate Suspension mentioned it, and yup, a little metal to metal contact noise on turning.

RE Rake - yup, knew there was a better word. Having done some more research yesterday, I'd say having rake on a FWD car will also improve power down out of corner due to weight transfer. Obviously this can be offset by too much camber. It felt a little grippier under throttle yesterday.

RE tyres, I've probably only got another couple of events on the current semi-slicks and will probably than go for the yoko AD08R as a single street and track tyre. It than puts me in the street class for timeattack.

[grandturismo]

Great update. Glad you found Ken helpful and competitively priced.

Street class is where it's at mate, then I may have some competition ;)

Re: your comment about improving power down out of the corner. Ken also recommended some firmer springs in the rear, he's trying to move me into a 750lb replacement for my current KW.

[VWindahouse]

Great update Sean :banana: can't wait to see the lap times tumble!

[seangti]

Great update. Glad you found Ken helpful and competitively priced.

Street class is where it's at mate, then I may have some competition ;)

Re: your comment about improving power down out of the corner. Ken also recommended some firmer springs in the rear, he's trying to move me into a 750lb replacement for my current KW.

Not sure about being competition for you mate, your laps time just keep dropping. My current aim is mid 63's at lakeside, with more time in the car I don't see that as over reaching. Last outing I wasn't getting a clean run onto the straight, I didn't have the confidence to commit to that final corner.



Great update Sean :banana: can't wait to see the lap times tumble!

You're always welcome to have a steer with the new suspension. You won't recognise the ride height though, it's like a giraffe.

[Stuwey]

You won't recognise the ride height though, it's like a giraffe.

Pic? Haha

[seangti]

Pic? Haha

I'll try get to it on the weekend after giving it a bath.

[seangti]

Spent the afternoon washing cars. My two and the missus. I won't share pics of hers...

Ride height wise, from ground to the highest point of each guard, the fronts is 60cm on both sides, rear is 62cm on drivers side and 62.7-ish on the passenger side. Not sure why the difference, could be intentional, or not. All our tracks are right handers, so whether having the rear left marginally higher aids turn in or grip... I'd be making it up to suggest either way.

The rear is probably near on 2inches higher to how it was when I bought it, so the car formerly known as red devil is now the red giraffe, haha :-) I'm really chuffed with it now. Arghh, come on October 11. :driver:


http://www.vwwatercooled.com.au/forums/images/imported/2014/09/DSC017681_zps65573dde-1.jpg (http://s1271.photobucket.com/user/seangt83/media/DSC01768-1_zps65573dde.jpg.html)


http://www.vwwatercooled.com.au/forums/images/imported/2014/09/DSC017602_zpsae4d0aff-1.jpg (http://s1271.photobucket.com/user/seangt83/media/DSC01760-2_zpsae4d0aff.jpg.html)


http://www.vwwatercooled.com.au/forums/images/imported/2014/09/DSC017642_zpse16a39c1-1.jpg (http://s1271.photobucket.com/user/seangt83/media/DSC01764-2_zpse16a39c1.jpg.html)


http://www.vwwatercooled.com.au/forums/images/imported/2014/09/DSC017661_zps716a1fc9-1.jpg (http://s1271.photobucket.com/user/seangt83/media/DSC01766-1_zps716a1fc9.jpg.html)

[team_v]

So how did it go out there today Sean.
It was pretty warm out my way so i imagine the seat intercooler and tyres would have got a workout.

[Jmac]

Hope that me IC pipe doing the job. How the turbo now? still waiting for norlocks, hoping latest fix holding up
Cheers
Jmac

[kaanage]

My current aim is mid 63's at lakeside, with more time in the car I don't see that as over reaching.
1:03.1378 so that's better than your expectations :) - well done!
Your times were pretty consistent in the low 64's to mid 63's so the low time wasn't a fluke, either.


You won't recognise the ride height though, it's like a giraffe.
Even the scrutineers joked that my PoD was a Polo Cross so you have a way to go :p

[seangti]

Hope that me IC pipe doing the job. How the turbo now? still waiting for norlocks, hoping latest fix holding up
Cheers
Jmac

Yup, the piping was sweet for the day. Turbo bolts or gasket not so sweet. It sounds like a VW Kombi again. I could hear it during the 4th session, but wasn't going to back off, but was happy with my times at that point so called it a day afterwards. I'll call or text you this week to make some time with you. The o2 sensor also reared it's head on the way to lakeside, but had the computer to reset it. Same codes as last time.


1:03.1378 so that's better than your expectations :) - well done!
Your times were pretty consistent in the low 64's to mid 63's so the low time wasn't a fluke, either.


Even the scrutineers joked that my PoD was a Polo Cross so you have a way to go :p

Yikes, how'd you find my times so quickly? :bowdown: On the Natsoft site already??

Yeah the car felt very good, very stable and didn't throw me any surprises. Knew there was a mid 63 in me/it as I only had one clear session before mechanicals last time. I feel there is a high 62s potential while I work on my braking and tidying a few driving traits. I felt that I wasn't always smooth getting on and off the brakes which unsettled the car a bit. Really had to focus on bracing myself before grabbing the brakes and remembering to modulate the pedal, I found it settled the car and was carrying a nicer entry and marginally more speed in to the corner.

For the last session and consistently faster laps, I ran 4th gear through the back dipper (hungry) and hairpin (eastern loop) rather than 3rd. It suffered only a little on exit of eastern loop, but prevented quite a bit of wheel spin and unbalancing the car during shifts, perhaps grabbing 3rd mid eastern loop to get me out may be worth trying. Apart from a missed gear shift, rather than grabbing 5th gear I got 3rd, almost shat myself as it was a 6k shift from 4th gear... :facepalm:, I didn't feel the need to rev past 6k all day.

Timeattack yesterday was awesome, not many cars out there. In one session I think there were only 3 or 4 of us. My last session, I didn't see anyway on the track, so clean, repetitive and committed laps.

There's more waffling I can/will elaborate on re tyre temps and pressures, will do that later. I'm uploading video at the moment, give it an hour before checking.


http://youtu.be/6boqgAeHtwA

[VWindahouse]

Fantastic times Sean :banana: congratulations mate!

Can't wait to see what you can do with a diff, the considerably lighter Enkie's and upping the boost :emo_baghead:

Game on.....

[seangti]

Fantastic times Sean :banana: congratulations mate!

Can't wait to see what you can do with a diff, the considerably lighter Enkie's and upping the boost :emo_baghead:

Game on.....

Cheers mate. Yeah for next season I'll swap the tyres on the rims and perhaps increase the boost. Traction is pretty darn good now, I think I'll continue to run semi slicks rather than a street tyre to timeattack.

Have also ordered a CG seat belt lock and will order a neck donut to help keep me safe should I hit something. There was a wrx into the wall in the morning session and I think it was a Supra on fire.

[Jmac]

unfortunately thatll be that almost impossible stud in the back of the turbo, its stretched like mad, sure itll be that one, its going to be an absolute pain to fix. Have to have a think about that one.
Message you later
Cheers
Jmac

[Eddy]

Hoyhoy.

Jimmy I should be getting under the Little Blue Girl again soon, so I'll try to get some pics of the turbo supports that I done.
Just done a full hard day @ Wakefield Park last weekend with the same result as for the last couple of years, turbo gasket still in place.

[seangti]

Thanks Eddy, all input is really appreciated.

I had a close look over it tonight, the bolt on the top left hand side (when facing it looking down) is loose as and hanging about 5mm. The other visible bolt appears tight. I'm struggling to get anything down there to tighten it so will now start removing bits to try gain access. So I'm curious as to how to diagnose the difference between heat stretch and vibration loosening? Is the outcome the same? I'll hit up some of the aeronautical engineers and techs at work for input.

Jimmy, I came across the Nord Lock washers on eBay USA, 50 25 Pair 5 16" 8mm Nord Lock Vibration Proof Lock Washers | eBay (http://m.ebay.com/itm/121188082917?cmd=VIDESC&gxo=true). At least now I/we know we can obtain them. I also found reference to them being used on model planes between the engine and frames... Again, some of the guys at work should be able to provide some input. Just not sure of the heat stress these washers can withstand and whether they'll 'mate' with manifold.

[Stuwey]

United Fasteners in Adelaide stock them. I bought 6 for $4.00. If you're looking for trade quantities Blackwoods sell them per/200.

Stainless Fasteners, Bolts And Studs, Bolts And Nuts (http://www.unitedfasteners.com.au)

Blackwoods | All Your Workplace Needs (http://www.blackwoods.com.au)

[vwthunder]

Cheers mate. Yeah for next season I'll swap the tyres on the rims and perhaps increase the boost.

I like the increase the boost part, your not running a LSD yet are you Sean ?

Also are you running real semi slicks or just 595 rsr's

Car looks fast from the video :banana:

[seangti]

I like the increase the boost part, your not running a LSD yet are you Sean ?

Also are you running real semi slicks or just 595 rsr's

Car looks fast from the video :banana:

No LSD at the moment, car felt to have sufficient grip so that'll wait at least intil I feel my driving and lack of LSD is the limiting factor. Though a plate style diff is around $4k installed so it may never happen...

Yup, running semi slicks which I got off Sharkie (if I recall correctly) sometime back, they are old but still gripping well. I'm running Bridgestone RE55s on the front and Toyo R888's on the rear on Audi TT rims, the tyres were made in 2008. So yeah, old, a bit hard, but still gripping better than street tyres. Will run new tyres for next years timeattack, not yet sure what tyre to run, and will run on the enkei's.

[seangti]

United Fasteners in Adelaide stock them. I bought 6 for $4.00. If you're looking for trade quantities Blackwoods sell them per/200.

Stainless Fasteners, Bolts And Studs, Bolts And Nuts (http://www.unitedfasteners.com.au)

Blackwoods | All Your Workplace Needs (http://www.blackwoods.com.au)

Thanks Stuwey. And you ran from on your turbo bolts?

[Stuwey]

Made a half-arsed attempt last weekend but kept getting distracted by Bathurst.

I'll have a proper go once i've got all my tools at home, not that I think it's currently leaking anyway.

[seangti]

I've booked my car in with NA Autosport to look into the turbo bolt issue. They run in timeattack, just completed world timeattack and have built many race cars of various forms of motorsport. The owner, Nick, first comment regarding the bolts was are they genuine VW bolts... which they aren't. Gav, Jimmy or Ant, do you know if the standard sized bolts fit the larger manifold? Question for anyone, anyone have experience or reason for not going back to genuine bolts? Seemed a little obvious when he asked, so am curious.

Anyone know the torque setting the bolts should be, or bolt details?

[Stuwey]

Best info i've found on the net is 35Nm.

http://home.comcast.net/~hhong4/images/K04/k03-18.jpg

Using genuine bolts, i've had no issues.

*the ones supplied by ECS for my K04 upgrade didn't look as nice as my originals, so i reused them.

[h100vw]

Best info i've found on the net is 35Nm.

http://www.vwwatercooled.com.au/forums/

Using genuine bolts, i've had no issues.

*the ones supplied by ECS for my K04 upgrade didn't look as nice as my originals, so i reused them.


VW ones aren't long enough for the after market manifold.

Gavin

[seangti]

VW ones aren't long enough for the after market manifold.

Gavin

Ahhh, ya killing me Gav. Lol

Thanks for diagram and input Stuwey.

[Stuwey]

VW ones aren't long enough for the after market manifold.

Well wouldn't THAT be about right. Haha.

[sambb]

I have a spare set of nordlocks at home that will help you. They are I.D 8.7mm for 8mm bolts. PM me with your details and i'll post them to you. You need a set of 3 yeah? I'll ask the fitters at work about torqueing them - you have to go a bit over so that when they get over the hump and click into place they settle at the correct value. There's a chart for it but I'm not sure how that works if you use one use stretch bolts like the VW ones.

Don't know if you've looked into it already or not but I just had my K03 exhaust manifold off and the mech. said that the mounting surfaces on both sides of the exhaust manifold and also the turbo were so far from flat it wasn't funny. He went through two belts before evrything was square and reckons that'd be a big reason why they'd not heat uniformally at the flanges and also blow gaskets.

[39erman]

... Bridgestone RE55s on the front and Toyo R888's on the rear on Audi TT rims, the tyres were made in 2008. So yeah, old, a bit hard..

Probably near their life's end, id say. Tyres are too old and the compound and case structure of an '08 tyre is no where near the current tyres. Yoky A050R are about the best there is today. Great grip, right down to the canvas and good life. We find that the A050R's only loose about .6 sec from new to ****ed!

Just gotta pressure them right, setup the car to suit the very stiff side walls and when not in use keep them in a dark place....

[seangti]

I have a spare set of nordlocks at home that will help you. They are I.D 8.7mm for 8mm bolts. PM me with your details and i'll post them to you. You need a set of 3 yeah? I'll ask the fitters at work about torqueing them - you have to go a bit over so that when they get over the hump and click into place they settle at the correct value. There's a chart for it but I'm not sure how that works if you use one use stretch bolts like the VW ones.

Don't know if you've looked into it already or not but I just had my K03 exhaust manifold off and the mech. said that the mounting surfaces on both sides of the exhaust manifold and also the turbo were so far from flat it wasn't funny. He went through two belts before evrything was square and reckons that'd be a big reason why they'd not heat uniformally at the flanges and also blow gaskets.

Thanks sam, will PM you. Very interesting comments on the surface quality. It is something I had considered, but overwhelmed with how to rectify. And you're running the factory manifold? I wonder the quality and surface condition of mine... Knowing the time, research and dedication from Anthony and those who've worked on the car, i'm inclined to think this is just a little gremlin that arises, perhaps more pronounced due to track time. It's running very similar gear to Gavin and his has seen plenty of happy lap pace and commuting, and still ok.


39er, thanks for the input. Will start my tyre research shortly. Doesn't like like I'll be hitting wakefield this year. VWNats in March is a sure thing.

[kaanage]

Probably near their life's end, id say. Tyres are too old and the compound and case structure of an '08 tyre is no where near the current tyres. Yoky A050R are about the best there is today. Great grip, right down to the canvas and good life. We find that the A050R's only loose about .6 sec from new to ****ed!

Just gotta pressure them right, setup the car to suit the very stiff side walls and when not in use keep them in a dark place....

The A050R is supposed be an upgrade of the A048R which handles heat cycles better but despite comments I've read of the A048R's going off quickly, mine have held up well over the past 2.5 years of use (about 10 events). In fact, in the last 3 track events, I've set 2 PB's and almost set another PB in the 3rd (which I was trying NOT to do since this was a regularity event).

I'd be more concerned about the possibility of the older tyres delaminating as the rubber hardens and loses its bond to the casing - I had 2 old stock A048Rs fail on me before I bought my current set of fresh stock tyres.

[sambb]

Yeah mine is just the stock factory manifold for the K03s.

[39erman]

The A050R is supposed be an upgrade of the A048R which handles heat cycles better but despite comments I've read of the A048R's going off quickly, mine have held up well over the past 2.5 years of use (about 10 events). In fact, in the last 3 track events, I've set 2 PB's and almost set another PB in the 3rd .

Sorry to shoot you down but your dreaming if you think the A048R's were ever any good. I ran them for 3 years in IPRA and hated them. They were only ever any good when green and they would loose around 2 to 3 secs a lap from green to their 2nd or 3rd run. Sure, they never wore out but they hated multi heat cycles. To be competetive we had to put 2 new tyres on the load side every meeting, where as the well heeled replaced a set every meeting, sometimes even 2 sets over the weekend.

The A050R's are simply astonishing in their grip and life and multiple multiple heat cycles dont bother them. Which is why 2nd hand A05R's are very hard to come by as the well heeled racer doesn't need to change them every meeting....

Try them, you'll never go back. Plus get an instant second or two faster lap timer BEFORE you start to play with your setup. Plus, in Regularity trials you drive to a time, not drive to set a time....

[Stuwey]

Thoughts on turbo bolts.

ARP, best fastner brand I can think of?
Caterpillar, 99% of the off road racers built their cars out of these as they are tough-as?
Do what the IP boys do and plain weld the turbo on!

[kaanage]

Plus, in Regularity trials you drive to a time, not drive to set a time....

No kidding - that's why I posted I was trying NOT to post a PB but the tyres let me get real close anyway. :p

I probably will try A050R's next time around but since I'm learning, I went the cheaper option since they were on special. I was expecting them to slow dramatically from posts that I'd read (like yours) but I was just pointing out my own experience where at worst, the have a stable plateau (which may be a fair bit worse than when they're at their best)

[seangti]

Thoughts on turbo bolts.

ARP, best fastner brand I can think of?
Caterpillar, 99% of the off road racers built their cars out of these as they are tough-as?
Do what the IP boys do and plain weld the turbo on!

Not sure yet, just spoke with one of the fella's at NA Autosport, they've ordered new studs and gasket. No idea what eact gear yet as the fellow I spoke with isn't the one working on the car. Will know more and share in the next few days.


All good info on the tyres. I have seen the A048R's for mid $200 a corner in 17... but if they fall away aggressively than it won't suit my purpose. I'd sacrifice some out right grip for consistency over the life of the tyre/season.

[Eddy]

Thoughts on turbo bolts.

ARP, best fastner brand I can think of?
Caterpillar, 99% of the off road racers built their cars out of these as they are tough-as?
Do what the IP boys do and plain weld the turbo on!


Hoyhoy.

Stu, & everyone else, I haven't had turbo bolt problems for some time now even with full hard days of tracking.
To start with I didn't weld the turbo on, only welded top plates on the bolts to refrain them from turning.
But like Jmac recently mentioned that along with other mods that I have done, all put together it works fine.
To start with turbo & manifold mounting surfaces all linished, the downpipe surface was shaped like a soup bowl.

Edd's lastest mod. list. - Page 4 (http://www.ozvolks.com/forums/showthread.php/119-Edd-s-lastest-mod-list?p=7333&viewfull=1#post7333)

To Improve Me Polo. - Page 3 (http://www.ozvolks.com/forums/showthread.php/1377-To-Improve-Me-Polo?p=7359&viewfull=1#post7359)

Secondly modified the original turbo to engine block bracket & added an extra one, both of these had upward force placed on them when doing up their bolts.
I'll try to get some pics of these soon.
May be if doing these mods, the bolts don't have to be welded, but I still like the weld.

[seangti]

Thanks Eddy. Just got off the phone from Nick at NA Autosport, they're waiting on a new manifold, apparently the turbo to manifold gasket of an 02 Audi TT will fit, so that's on order (its an aftermarket manifold). The bolts are on the way too. Once it all arrives, they'll check the surfaces are appropriately flat, if not, will address that. They'll also add in the extra bracket that Eddy's referring to to provide additional support to the turbo, and lastly, he's planning to use nord lock washers and probably wire lock the bolts.

No idea what this is going to cost, but should be the last time it happens :facepalm:

Have also asked for a check over of the car for any other track oriented recommendations to ensure reliability.

[seangti]

To Improve Me Polo. - Page 3 (http://www.ozvolks.com/forums/showthread.php/1377-To-Improve-Me-Polo?p=7359&viewfull=1#post7359)


Eddy, is that a standard exhaust manifold you're runnng that's been coated?

Update on my car, all the required parts are in, surfaces have been sanded flat, though the ATP manifold has cracked. Gav is sorting me a standard manifold, I'll see if it can been high flowed next week, or whatever is recommended. They found a few other surprises so they'll be addressed to.

I'm hoping to collect the car next friday, to head to Morgan Park on Saturday for a full day of racing on Sunday. This will be quite a test for the car as I haven't completed half a day of driving without an issue, let alone a full day and the 400+km round trip there and back. Baptism of fire... shoudn't mention fire.

[Eddy]

Eddy, is that a standard exhaust manifold you're runnng that's been coated?


Hoyhoy.

That it is.

Edd's lastest mod. list. - Page 4 (http://www.ozvolks.com/forums/showthread.php/119-Edd-s-lastest-mod-list?p=7334&viewfull=1#post7334)

[seangti]

Hoyhoy.

That it is.

Edd's lastest mod. list. - Page 4 (http://www.ozvolks.com/forums/showthread.php/119-Edd-s-lastest-mod-list?p=7334&viewfull=1#post7334)

Thanks mate, that'll do the job for me than.

[Paazuzu]

Good luck Sean...I hope this sorts the issue once and for all!!

[Eddy]

Hoyhoy.

O.K. folks here's a couple of pics of the turbo support brackets I done a while back.


The first pics shows in red the extra rib welded to the standard support bracket & in blue the bottom part of the extra bracket.

http://www.vwwatercooled.com.au/forums/images/imported/2014/11/00330highlighted_zpsebc0c808-1.jpg (http://s184.photobucket.com/user/eddy13_photos/media/00330highlighted_zpsebc0c808.jpg.html)


The second pics shows the extra bracket where the top of the blue is @ the downpipe flange.

http://www.vwwatercooled.com.au/forums/images/imported/2014/11/01130highlighted_zpsedc00032-1.jpg (http://s184.photobucket.com/user/eddy13_photos/media/01130highlighted_zpsedc00032.jpg.html)

Both of these are set up to give extra uplift when doing up the bolts.
May be to understand these pics., ya have to have a good look when upside down & underneath.
Hoping this helps a bit.

[Jmac]

Sorry im booked up and haven't got back, I know exactly why the gasket is blowing again, the inner stud is stretched to buggery, it realy need the turbo off and new stud, you will see it not just a case of fitting bolts or it would have been fixed.
Ah well , hope all goes well
Jmac

[seangti]

Thanks again Eddy. Jimmy, that's exactly what's being done at the moment. I still have the o2 sensor light coming on so will have to catch-up when everything else is sorted if that's ok. I have a copy of the saved code, but as it's the ebay version of vcds, doesn't give much detail.


I went by NA Autosport this morning to drop off the manifolds Gav offered. Their first impression is that it's too small and restrictive for the application :facepalm: I've been learning what I can about manifolds, flow rates, porting, etc, but my head hurts. I've all but conceded in putting the std manifold back on. If it runs well, lucky me, if not, I'll have to do further research to better understand what makes a good manifold. At the moment I don't know enough to be buying anything with any level of understanding of what I'm putting on. I've come this far and am happy to spend the money, but want to know what I'm spending it on first (and don't want the S.O.B cracking).

There's some challenges getting the ATP manifold off, so at least by putting the standard on, should I change over in the future, I will at least be able to reach what I need to get to it. Other than this issue, Nick was of generally high praise for the workmanship, forethought and parts on the car, so that's positive feedback to those who've been involved. Hopefully this thread doesn't read as a 15 page whinge. I appreciate there's little to no prior warning signs for the issues I've had.

Going back to standard manifold, do I need to consider my current ecu tune set-up? Would it be safe to head to the track this weekend or best to scan it first?

He's the crack in the ATP manifold:
http://i1271.photobucket.com/albums/jj623/seangt83/IMG_1882_zps3a390ab6.jpg (http://s1271.photobucket.com/user/seangt83/media/IMG_1882_zps3a390ab6.jpg.html)

[Jmac]

Seen plenty ATP cracks but was at the wastegate to be fair and this can happen many turbos and cause no issue. This is super bad, its a chuck away
Jmac

[seangti]

So the ATP manifolds aren't inherently a poor product? Or it's application dependent? Open to recommendations of manifolds.

[G60ING]

A couple years ago when 20V were popular with friends I use to hear about how the ATP manifolds sucked because of nut access and how they would loosen up.

If it's cracking then yes you are screwed, because as I remember their customer service sucks.

Every once in a blue moon an apr manifold gets sold separate from a turbo kit on the vortex.

[Jmac]

Cant agree more with nut access!!!!!! thankfully someone has had the same issue, they are a nightmare to fit and I did this in situ, was a fair while ago I might add. Engine out , piece of Cake
Cheers
Jmac

[VWindahouse]

Cant agree more with nut access!!!!!! thankfully someone has had the same issue, they are a nightmare to fit and I did this in situ, was a fair while ago I might add. Engine out , piece of Cake
Cheers
Jmac

Yes it's a big regret putting Jimmy thru that hell without warning but I had no idea tbh. Sorry again Jimmy :)

Sean sorry bud I was not aware the mani had cracked as Gav will attest there were never any symptoms to show that but then again I never went harder than 20mins at Happy Laps. Will your EGT's go crazy high with the stock mani? Hell yes and dangerously so from the research I've done (mainly from vortex) as in glowing red hot - no bull. I know it's more coin but please consider a second Gen JBS mani and get it coated with the black ceramic the exhaust is done in or something similar.

[seangti]

Thanks Anthony. Yeah there's no way of telling before this stuff breaks. I will be looking into other manifolds and learning about them so I know what the go is. If it means de-tuning for the meantime to keep it safe, so be it. Hopefully with the standard mani in place it won't be half the task to replace it in the future.

Assuming I get the back today, do I run a risk in running the car this weekend without changing the tune?

[h100vw]

I/you can pull the boost back with the VCDS cable and unisettings. Can't measure EGTs or anything obviously but you can do a few hard laps then, pull off and see how the manifold looks.

Gavin

[seangti]

I/you can pull the boost back with the VCDS cable and unisettings. Can't measure EGTs or anything obviously but you can do a few hard laps then, pull off and see how the manifold looks.

Gavin

righteo. Last time I tried the unitronic software didn't allow me access. I can't recall the error code, will try again tonight.

[h100vw]

righteo. Last time I tried the unitronic software didn't allow me access. I can't recall the error code, will try again tonight.

Call me when you are trying it. In work from 7, so anytime is good.

GAvin

[seangti]

Pretty hectic weekend of car stuff. Picked up the car friday night. Standard manifold on with nord lock washers and lock wired bolts, gaskets, etc. It ain't going anywhere now. The car was initially over boosting to 25psi, found it to be the vacuum line was off the wastegate. Geez I want to run 25psi, it hammered, came on boost very early and hard. Anyway, back to "slow spec" 20psi now.

Ran out to Morgan Park, Warwick, yesterday afternoon to do a Paul Stokell event today. Was on the street tyres as it was meant to be a training event, though was more so like an open circuit session, with access to trainers for a few laps. Did a 1:36.06sec of the large track on my GPS laptimer, not particularly impressive, but given the heat (33-35c day), tyres and not chasing a lap time I'm ok with that. Only issue was breaking an exhaust mount in the 3rd session, just after the dump pipe, rattling like a mofo. Did the 4th session, packed up and drove it home. I didn't have car stands with me so wasn't going to get under it. Will deal with that next weekend.

Good times.

[grandturismo]

Good times alright. The car seemed to go really well other than that exhaust mount. Did that rattle in the pillar disappear?

[seangti]

Good times alright. The car seemed to go really well other than that exhaust mount. Did that rattle in the pillar disappear?

Not sure about that rear rattle, couldn't hear anything over the exhaust bracket rattling, lol. Glad I carry ear plugs with me.

Did you end up putting stiffer rear springs in? You sort that through Ken at Accurate? Any feedback?

I had Paul Stokell co-pilot for a few laps, his feedback was to stiffen up the rear sway bar to dial out some understeer (along with putting in an LSD). I feel the understeer was more pronounced at Morgan than I've experienced recently at Lakeside, perhaps primarily the tyres, but could also be the slower corners. Front downforce wouldn't go astray either.

Will have to get back to Morgan Park in the cooler months.

[Jmac]

Nordlocks? Geez that's a good idea ;)

[kaanage]

I had Paul Stokell co-pilot for a few laps, his feedback was to stiffen up the rear sway bar to dial out some understeer (along with putting in an LSD). I feel the understeer was more pronounced at Morgan than I've experienced recently at Lakeside, perhaps primarily the tyres, but could also be the slower corners. Front downforce wouldn't go astray either.

You can run with a "looser" rear end at a slower track to help it point but it can get scary very quickly at a track with fast sweeping bends. I don't know much about Morgan Park but it doesn't look like you'd be going fast enough to get much downforce without a huge splitter.

LSD? Yeah, we all want one (except Eddy since he has that covered)

[grandturismo]

No stiffer springs as yet. Definitely will consider it in the near future. There's a few things I can adjust and play around with before I go spending more money though.

Interestingly, I had a lot more understeer happening at MP, but most of that I can put down to bad driving but I do think reducing the front ride height a bit and possibly increasing rebound damping at the fronts may help. That was my thought process anyway, but I'll have a chat with Ken and show him some video. He'll probably tell me to stop over driving and hit the apex ;)

Do you have sway bars? I'd check the fronts are fairly stiff first that should help.

[Eddy]

Hoyhoy.

Ya have to set it up so it has over steer on cold tyres. (stiffen the rear)
I change the rear sway bar setting for the track, I have the front 24mm front set up to the stiffest all the time.
Even then you will still get plenty of under steer once when warmed up, when going hard, especially with slower corners.

P.S. Sorry Greg, I know ya once said that swerving to heat up the tyres (rear ones) was a waste of time, but I find it necessary to get the faster times.
I may be wrong, but I find this does help heaps..

[kaanage]

Stiffer front anti-roll bar => more understeer, not less, gt.

FWD will alway understeer on exit of slow turns - that's just a fact of life if the car to be at all balanced for entry and mid-corner.

Eddy, I reckon you're warming yourself up, not the tyres whilst weaving around. You may also be scrubbing off pickup from the previous session but tyres need sustained loading to generate any significant heat. Unless you're out to get best times in the 2nd lap of a session, I don't see warmup weaving providing any overall benefit.

Here's a test done with bikes to try and measure the effect. A car is much heavier but also wears bigger tyres and more of them to distribute the weight. Tire Temp. and Weaving (http://www.rcramer.com/shop/rrw_weaving.shtml)

[grandturismo]

Stiffer front anti-roll bar => more understeer, not less, gt.

FWD will alway understeer on exit of slow turns - that's just a fact of life if the car to be at all balanced for entry and mid-corner.

Eddy, I reckon you're warming yourself up, not the tyres whilst weaving around. You may also be scrubbing off pickup from the previous session but tyres need sustained loading to generate any significant heat. Unless you're out to get best times in the 2nd lap of a session, I don't see warmup weaving providing any overall benefit.

Here's a test done with bikes to try and measure the effect. A car is much heavier but also wears bigger tyres and more of them to distribute the weight. Tire Temp. and Weaving (http://www.rcramer.com/shop/rrw_weaving.shtml)

Yep you're right.
I was trying to say perhaps tweak the stiffness to an even level that suits the vehicle before adjusting for understeer or oversteer. Having said that probably best to soften first to correct.

[seangti]

It's got adjustable sway bars front and rear. The front is on the softer setting, the rear sway bar is in the mid section. On the semi slicks and at lakeside, understeer hasn't been much of a consideration on this set-up. When I do QR next I will stiffen the rear to see how that feels. I'm somewhat reluctant to stiffen the rear much at lakeside as I'd prefer to not go backwards under the bridge should it get overly twitchy. I'm still working up to full throttle through that section, I'm lifting a bee's whisker before tipping in, but once committed it's on the floor boards.

In saying all this, corner entry at high and low speed is quite adjustable and playful, just trying to get power to the ground on the tighter stuff, e.g. morgan park coming out of the esses on to the straight was more pronounced than i'd experienced to date. Perhaps I should have ran the semi slicks as I doubt the understeer would be as prevelent.

All good fun hey.

[Eddy]

Stiffer front anti-roll bar => more understeer, not less, gt.

FWD will alway understeer on exit of slow turns - that's just a fact of life if the car to be at all balanced for entry and mid-corner.

Eddy, I reckon you're warming yourself up, not the tyres whilst weaving around. You may also be scrubbing off pickup from the previous session but tyres need sustained loading to generate any significant heat. Unless you're out to get best times in the 2nd lap of a session, I don't see warmup weaving providing any overall benefit.

Here's a test done with bikes to try and measure the effect. A car is much heavier but also wears bigger tyres and more of them to distribute the weight. Tire Temp. and Weaving (http://www.rcramer.com/shop/rrw_weaving.shtml)

Hoyhoy.


First thing Greg, why have a front sway bar @ all.
Secondly, if your going hard enough, understeer with braking happens when entering turns more so than exiting.
>
I know that I'm just a silly old fart, but even with myself driving the Little Blue Girl, the fact is that I have several official sub 1'10" times @ Waky & guess what the Little Blue Girl is the only Polo to do this, may be its just a fluke.
To top it off She's drive down to Waky from the Gold Coast & now also tows a trailer as well.
>
Below shows Warren Luff who grew up on this track & also had more HP than the Little Blue Girl - 270 against 240 approx.
His time was 1'10".2

http://www.vwwatercooled.com.au/forums/f127/functional-flat-underbody-rear-diffuser-design-82035-post912022.html#post912022

[h100vw]

When I do QR next I will stiffen the rear to see how that feels. I'm somewhat reluctant to stiffen the rear much at lakeside as I'd prefer to not go backwards under the bridge should it get overly twitchy.


I set mine to full stiff before the last HL. Felt OK there but definitely not so much on the loop onto the highway from the airport. It feels really twitchy there and has probably lost 5-10kmh off the max speed I dare to hit.

I should back it off to confirm my suspicion.

Gavin

[seangti]

We're talking sway bar settings though the appropriate setting is dependent on the spring rate. A stiffer spring on the rear will allow you to run the front sway bar setting harder to compensate or balance the car. Eddy, are you running the standard rear KW springs? I had a feeling you'd changed rear springs? This may better explain why it works.

I will swerve in the first lap of the first session to get a feel for the grip levels and scrub the tyres. I don't know if it increases heat, but it improves my focus and feel.

Sounds like I need some trial and error to see what works for my set up and my driving style.

It's good to hear of the different set ups and what's working for each of us.

Gav, yeah the risk of swapping ends on the streets are higher given the reality of mid corner lift off.

[seangti]

http://www.vwwatercooled.com.au/forums/f127/functional-flat-underbody-rear-diffuser-design-82035-post912022.html#post912022

ahhh, the memories of an old thread and the joys of hindsight. Just gotta get out there and drive the damn things, if it's not working for you, work out whether it's you or the car, than what's the most practical approach to change, you or the car.

Eddy, would be tops to do a track day with you as a point of reference, compare notes and check out your car. At the moment I can only compare to mk6 golft GTI's and R's. I anticipate doing the VW Nats next year at wakefield, whenever that is.

[kaanage]

We're talking sway bar settings though the appropriate setting is dependent on the spring rate. A stiffer spring on the rear will allow you to run the front sway bar setting harder to compensate or balance the car. Eddy, are you running the standard rear KW springs? I had a feeling you'd changed rear springs? This may better explain why it works.

I will swerve in the first lap of the first session to get a feel for the grip levels and scrub the tyres. I don't know if it increases heat, but it improves my focus and feel.

Sounds like I need some trial and error to see what works for my set up and my driving style.

It's good to hear of the different set ups and what's working for each of us.

Gav, yeah the risk of swapping ends on the streets are higher given the reality of mid corner lift off.

It's quite possible that the H&R springs that came with my cup kit have stiffer rear rates relative to the front which is why I found that my PoD was pretty much perfectly balanced without a rear anti-roll bar (and why I only added one when uprating the front ARB). The balance is set by the relative roll stiffness so the springs absolutely play a roll (pun intended).

The swerving around to get a feel is what I mean about warming yourself up rather than the tyres. I do it by playing with corner speed and throttle on the first lap of a session for the reasons I have stated before.

With faster corners (eg turn 1 at Phillip Island or Eastern Creek), it doesn't take much mid corner lift off to turn the car around if you set the car to "point". I had this due to too much rake when I ran the rear perches.

[Eddy]

Eddy, are you running the standard rear KW springs? I had a feeling you'd changed rear springs? This may better explain why it works.


Hoyhoy.

Yeah I do have stronger rear springs as well as the fronts, so things will be different to any others.

[seangti]

Picture of the crack in the manifold while it was on the car. Crack is through the whole way.
http://www.vwwatercooled.com.au/forums/images/imported/2014/11/0504B592AC2B4888BD249885B6AD0489_zps3hgd-1.jpg (http://s1271.photobucket.com/user/seangt83/media/Mobile%20Uploads/0504B592-AC2B-4888-BD24-9885B6AD0489_zps3hgdqbf6.jpg.html)

[Jmac]

[QUOTE=seangti;1097430]Picture of the crack in the manifold while it was on the car. Crack is through the whole way.
http://www.vwwatercooled.com.au/forums/images/imported/2014/11/0504B592AC2B4888BD249885B6AD0489_zps3hgd-1.jpg (http://s1271.photobucket.com/user/seangt83/media/Mobile%20Uploads/0504B592-AC2B-4888-BD24-9885B6AD0489_zps3hgdqbf6.jpg.html)

The bracket that wasn't on the exhaust. There were no bolts.
http://www.vwwatercooled.com.au/forums/images/imported/2014/11/CE03F28AC5A24264989CB428BD24A553_zpsdp2o-1.jpg (http://s1271.photobucket.com/user/seangt83/media/Mobile%20Uploads/CE03F28A-C5A2-4264-989C-B428BD24A553_zpsdp2oipgb.jpg.html)[/QUOT
Nice crack, and its the one with the dodgy stud. No nuts on the bracket man that's poor. Never seen that , didn't have the pipe off mind you and that sort of thing should have stuck out, no way they should run off so they musnt have been there, maybe just in there location , that under heatshield, not sure judging by pick? I was paying more attention to the short circuit, ( main reason car was in care, Guess I have to add that , shouldn't but do ;)) not to worry mind wont help it now. Hope the new manifold holds up , that's making me think big time with the ATP I was going to use on my 20V conv.
Jmac

[seangti]

Hope the new manifold holds up , that's making me think big time with the ATP I was going to use on my 20V conv.
Jmac

Yup. The ATP does flow better than the standard, there's certainly been a drop in power with the standard manifold having gone back on. I think it'd be equivalent to dropping a few psi in boost, or to overcome, adding a few. It revved freer before. For the meantime, it's staying as it is as the cost of a new manifold and labour associated doesn't translate. For lap times, itd be money better spent on track time, driver training and/or tyres.

[grandturismo]

Group buy Advan A050 anyone?

[seangti]

Group buy Advan A050 anyone?

I'd be interested in pricing them.

[kaanage]

I need a couple after today :facepalm:

[seangti]

Here's some video of mates running last weekend at timeattack. I wasn't running, for the same old reason as other occasions... Car is back in the shop, will elaborate at a later time.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BDzCvuWUyLo&list=UUEyxvcueIqEi9C-l0wKpwkA

[grandturismo]

Great Vid. Its always interesting to hear exhaust notes and how slow you look :)

[seangti]

Had a dyno run done on Friday to see how it's all going, made 170.2kwat.

http://www.vwwatercooled.com.au/forums/images/imported/2014/11/img108_zps9e62791c-1.jpg (http://s1271.photobucket.com/user/seangt83/media/img108_zps9e62791c.jpg.html)

[team_v]

170 at the front wheels with the stock manifold and a safe level tune is pretty decent.

[seangti]

170 at the front wheels with the stock manifold and a safe level tune is pretty decent.

Yup, will see Gavin about increasing the fueling giving the way it'll be driving. More fuel will help manage the EGT's. That could have contributed to the cracking of the ATP manifold. Just some final tweaking.

Hopefully the car is now sorted for a hassle free run for next years timeattack. Now to save funds for tyres and perhaps changing brake pads to something more track oriented. Considering Performance Friction Pads. My mechanic rates em very highly, runs em all their track and rally cars. Than to learn how to drive :P

[seangti]

Starting to gear up for the 2015 TimeAttack season after a quiet couple of months. Only done a few things on the car and barely driven it due to work and personal travels... I had a "moment" at Wakefield last year when under brakes, while the mechanic was looking at something else he saw evidence of my issue - residual brake fluid around the caliper. So under a heavy brake application, it leaked from the banjo bolt. Consequently, fronts calipers were overhauled and had to replace the rears (bin job). The rears calipers are from a VW Bora V5 AWD as the rotors are larger than standard.

I've also replaced the front sway bar links with some Whiteline HD links, this was doe to a knocking noise I was experiencing. Only did this last week and in the 50kms I've driven, no more knocks. These are adjustable length links, but essentially the same length as standard links, which are about 1 inch longer to what was in there - I'm not sure how changing the length and subsquent angle of the sway bar will influence the front end behaviour. Eitherway, the car is higher than it was when the shorter links went on, which from recollection is what necessitated the requirement for the shorter links.

I'm going to toy with rear sway bar settings and the rear wing, going more aggressive with both. Run the sway bar harder to aid turn in and exit on the slower corners, with the hope that increasing the angle of attack of the wing will combat the tendency to oversteer at speed. I've been doing quite a bit of research into aerodynamics, this stuff is truly addictive.


This years plan/committment:
- General Practice at QR in January for a shake down
- Timeattack Lakeside Round 1 commences 7th March
- Timeattack Wakefield 30th March (booked)
- VW Nationals at Wakefield in May (probable)

The only only foreseeale mod at the moment is some fabrication work to the pedal area to allow for heel-toeing.

[team_v]

So no flat underbody work or big lip like the pro racers?

Shame about the brakes.
I assume that you have braided lines on it?

[seangti]

So no flat underbody work or big lip like the pro racers?

Shame about the brakes.
I assume that you have braided lines on it?

There is a fellow member who's having Andrew Brilliant design some aero panels and having it built locally. Do a google or youtube search on him, he's quite the guru of aerodynamics. Can't wait to see the results, though the CAD work I've seen is phenominal. The price may put hold to that idea for me. We're talking chassis mounted and reinforced aero producing 300kgs+ of downforce on a hatch back. Andrew is the aerodynamasist behind APR Performance, the design of the wing on the car and provides computational fluid dynamic calculations to demonstrate wing performance. I now better understand and appreciate the path that Anthony was following.

Re the brakes, the issue was around the banjo bolt and the mounting of the brake lines to the caliper. The lines are braided and all sweet. I will be looking into a more track oriented pad in the next few months, along with having to replace the tyres, another set of semi's is most likely. I won't have new tyres for Wakefield in March which I'll use to learn the track, but will have new tyres for Nationals where I'll have a more serious crack at a lap time.

[seangti]

In prepartation of driving to Goulburn, I hought I'd try quieten the exhaust a bit, though got told there's not much that can be done without being restrictive. 2 resonators and the canon muffler. As I track it, they didn't support the dual pass muffler idea. Sounds like earmuffs or man up... ear muffs it is :-)

Did a happy laps at QR this morning with the Toyota 86 club, was a good morning to get some heat into everything. It all ran well. Blew off the large pipe that plumbs in the DV, damn butterfly clip. But all good, got a tow back to pits, vice grips and 5secs later was all sorted. So will replace that butterfly clip with a jubilee. As per murphy's law, I carry jubilee clips, but only the sizes that are just too small, or too big. Got another happy laps in a fortnight, than timeattack and wakefield in March :banana:

[Jmac]

You can make 1 jubilee by joining 2. Done it plenty of times

[seangti]

Lakeside TimeAttack kicks off again tomorrow, to say i'm excited is an understatement. Yehaa, long off season.

The car has been running well lately. In putting on the semi-slicks I noticed the front brake pads getting a little low (ok, at least 1/3 wear left), so have ordered some QFM A1RM pads. As the remsa's have been fine to date, I think going up a notch is reasonable without going to an outright track pad as yet.

I'm quietly ambitious about lap times for this season. On the current set-up/tyres, I'm hoping to drop my lap time by 0.5-0.8 of a second. From a 63.1 to a low-mid 62. From my GPS data, there's half a second available from eastern loop to the start/finish line, just gotta commit and get the right line for the last turn onto the straight. I don't see much gain elsewhere, my sectors are otherwise very consistent, but have noticed some inconsistency in that final sector. I don't plan on going for a PB tomorrow, but will see how it all feels when I'm out there. Priority is for a safe and reliable season.

Also amped about Wakefield at the end of the month. I'm going to practice wakefield on an RFactor simulator next weekend. Bit of track time before the real thing will hopefully slightly lessen the learning curve.

[Paazuzu]

Good luck Sean! Hope it all goes well mate.

[seangti]

Good luck Sean! Hope it all goes well mate.

It all went really well today. 4 sessions of "carbon cleansing" and no hint of a niggle.

Best lap of a 1:03.36 (my PB is 1:03.1), but given it was 31+degrees all morning and full tank of a fuel, I'm very happy with that. Having the rear sway bar on hard was all good too, had a few little slides, but generally happy with the balance. Lap times weren't as consistent as other occasions which I'm putting down mostly to heat soak more than anything. Had a hoot. :-)

obligatory picture
http://www.vwwatercooled.com.au/forums/images/imported/2015/03/GOPR10793_zpsvoe2skx7-1.jpg (http://s1271.photobucket.com/user/seangt83/media/GOPR1079-3_zpsvoe2skx7.jpg.html)

[grandturismo]

Well done Sean, great to see no issues with Round 1 now out the way. Bring on the colder weather!!

[seangti]

Well on Saturday I started the trek to Goulburn to run at Wakefield on Monday. What an awful drive south, it broke me. I was muttering how I will never do this drive again (though yet to drive back to Brisbane). :-( Anyway, got to Goulburn on Sunday with a drama free, albeit rough and noisy, drive.

There were 2 other watercooled members who went down, Ben (Machine) in a Golf R and Alan (Grandturismo) in his mkVI GTI. Unfortunately Alan had an issue as we drove out to wakefield, so his day never really started and went back to Sydney to get it sorted as he's running at Eastern Creek today. So 3 became 2. We did a TarmacAttack day, which consists of open practice in the morning and timed laps in the afternoon. My best official timed lap was a 1:12.48. I did a GPS timed 1:12.1 in the morning and was really hoping to be in the 11’s, but wasn’t to be. 11’s was my goal when coming down, which was based off times of other polo’s. I'm still really quite happy with the lap time, it was a bit hard to a clean hot lap with the other drivers of varying speed. The suspension set-up/chassis balance is awesome, I was getting a reasonable amount of oversteer on cold tyres, but as they came up to temp it was great, nicely adjustable without being twitchy. With the power of the car, I really struggled to get power down without an LSD. Turn 8 (fish hook) was a trial of patience waiting till I could get back on the gas, and when I would, it’d boost and light up the inside tyre. Similarly coming on to the straight.

Wakefield is an awesome circuit, more fun than QR and Lakeside, more like Morgan Park, but better still. I had an absolutely blast, it almost made the drive down worth it, the car ran well all day, I was 9th quickest of the cars out there, losing out to a few Evo’s, fast honda’s and a bloody Golf R driven by Ben :-). Though the car is looping at idle now, not sure what the go is so will look into that before driving home on Friday :icon_headbang:.

[kaanage]

Sounds like you need a trailer (and tow vehicle)
Wakefield is pretty good fun :) but technical so don't be to fussed about your first up time

[seangti]

Sounds like you need a trailer (and tow vehicle)

Yup, will pull rank on the wife's car if there's a next time.

[Eddy]

Hoyhoy.

Sounds like ya had fun Sean, its a nice track, one of a kind.
But ya don't have to tow it, I tow down there with it.

[seangti]

I found the culprit to the looping idle, the vacuum line from the boost controller to the wastegate had blown/tore down near the wastegate.

Eddy, I really need an LSD for Wakefield and fresh tyres. I have new tyres sitting in Brisbane, but the LSD won't be happening anytime soon, if at all. Have you driven eastern creek, Al and Ben drove it yesterday, they loved it. I worked :-(

[Eddy]

Hoyhoy.

Yeah, I done Eastern Creek once about 8yrs ago in a Dutton Rally.
Nice track, but for me in a strange car & not having a clue on where I was going, especially over that hill was a bit much for my old age.
My knackers aren't big enough for the 1st turn, its awesome but if anything goes wrong...:goodluck:

[kaanage]

Turn 1 at the creek is awesomely fast - a gear faster than turn 1 at The Island. You definitely don't want a twitchy setup for turns like these.

Which hill are you talking about, Eddy? The one between 3 and 4?

Winton has a similar feel to Wakefield except that the twisty section of Wakefield is on the side of a hill and an LSD would be a huge benefit at both.

[Eddy]

Hoyhoy.

Greg, under the bridge going into turn 8 I think it is, didn't have a clue as to where I was going.

[h100vw]

I found the culprit to the looping idle, the vacuum line from the boost controller to the wastegate had blown/tore down near the wastegate.

Eddy, I really need an LSD for Wakefield and fresh tyres. I have new tyres sitting in Brisbane, but the LSD won't be happening anytime soon, if at all. Have you driven eastern creek, Al and Ben drove it yesterday, they loved it. I worked :-(

I never thought when you were on the phone yesterday. Was it not make ludicrous boost?

Gavin

[seangti]

I never thought when you were on the phone yesterday. Was it not make ludicrous boost?

Gavin

Not ludicrous, but was over boosting. Reaching 24psi. I'd been nursing it off boost and had the N75 disconnected, but going up a mountain I gave it a tickle and noticed it had exceeded the 8psi...

Not sure if, or more likely how long I was running at wakefield at 24psi. Normal boost is 20psi, though it boosts harder, earlier when the wastegate line isn't connected.

Eddy, sounds like you're referring to Oran Park.

[Eddy]

Eddy, sounds like you're referring to Oran Park.

Hoyhoy.

Na, Eastern Creek.

[Bullet Fast]

Turn 1 at the creek is awesomely fast - a gear faster than turn 1 at The Island. You definitely don't want a twitchy setup for turns like these.

Which hill are you talking about, Eddy? The one between 3 and 4?

Winton has a similar feel to Wakefield except that the twisty section of Wakefield is on the side of a hill and an LSD would be a huge benefit at both.
On a bike, there's plenty of track corners in Australia that cause me distress; crash corner at Broadford, blind entry to jagged ripple strip on turn 3 at Winton, Lukey Heights... I don't think anything compares to jamming the picks on at a genuine 270kph to drop in STILL up around 200 and whacking a knee down, only to go back to full throttle a second later. I'm sweating just thinking about it. I'd think running a car into turn one pretty luxurious by comparison!

[DeanB]

Hoyhoy.

My knackers aren't big enough for the 1st turn, its awesome but if anything goes wrong...:goodluck:

I remember years ago I used to do the drive days out there in my Swift GTI and I guy in a Skyline GTR went way too fast into that 1st turn, anyway the dust cloud cleard and there was the Skyline on its lid ! Sort of wakes you up a little that if you **** that corner up you are in trouble. Anyway, looked like it had gone over a few times, the guy was okay, they used the forklift to tip it onto its wheels and then it picked it up and carried it back into the pits ... full of kitty litter and whatever other junk it swallowed while rolling over, the sunroof was missing, etc. Expensive mistake.

[grandturismo]

Turn 1 is the fastest I've ever experienced @ EC. Turn 9 got me good in the wet but managed to wash off some mud and get back out.

Great effort all round Sean, on the drive down and the excellent times you managed to get. I'm sure if it was a regular haunt for you then PBs would certainly come down.

Did you get any video of the day?

[seangti]

Time for some video evidence I suppose. Just a quick video of 2 clean laps. Was quite difficult to get clean, committed consecutive laps. I welcome any constructive feedback by those who know the circuit.

Looking over the GPS laptimer data, I did a best of 1:12.1, though pulling the sectors together for comparison it shows a theoretical best of 1:10.7. On one lap I was 1.26 seconds up on the 1:12.1, but seem to have conceded the lap in the last sector to result in a 1:12.4 - which might even be the official timed lap... :facepalm: On that lap, I was 0.7 quicker through the fish hook alone, and 0.5sec quicker from start/finish to turn 6. Would be good to find the video and do the overlay of those laps... Oh well, plenty of time to be found should there be a next time :banana:

The drive back was much more pleasant than the drive down, albeit with Easter traffic and police. Even got pulled over coming through Sydney - "I pulled you over for a RBT and I also noticed your car is modified". Yup, the police officers words. No drama's, did the RBT, he checked the engine bay for BOV and airfilter being enclosed and the front tyres having tread. First time in over 10yrs to be targeted, I guess the car stands out a bit :-)

Any feedback is appreciated.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f1gcRrsef9I

[seangti]

Another video. That S2000 had over heating issues, so would do hot lap, than circulate for a few slow laps causing me a little grief. He was doing 1:08's if I recall correctly.



https://youtu.be/5Uy48RszQAs

[Machine]

Can't believe I didn't know this thread existed until today. Anyway, I've read through all pages and to make up for my absence:

15544

[Water Boy]

Are you planning to head to VW nationals in May at SMP?

[seangti]

Are you planning to head to VW nationals in May at SMP?
Unfortunately not anymore. Would LOVE to run that track as I didnt when i was down in March. It was on the agenda to go, but currently pulling the turbo off as its got a gremlin inside. I may come for a look depending on my work movements, but will be rollin in a rental car. Will re-aim for later in the year.

[seangti]

As mentioned above, I'm in the process of pulling the turbo off to get it rebuilt. Had been leaking oil around it from somewhere and occasionally blowing white smoke. Just got a few bolts remaining for it to be out. For the most part, the job has been really quite straight forward, just time consuming and a few phone calls and supervision from Gavin. I don't typically enjoy doing mechanical work, but has been fine so far.

Before wakefield I ordered a new set of semi slicks, Kumho V70A in medium compound, 215/45/17. The price was too good to not snap em up. I had expected to chop my current tyres more at wakefield, but that circuit seems to be much more gentle on tyres than the qld circuits, so will get another day or two from the current tyres. I did however chomp my brake pads, so replaced with A1RM's, from the 100km i did a week ago, they feel amazing.

Here's a pic from on the way to wakefield.

http://www.vwwatercooled.com.au/forums/images/imported/2015/04/11150213_10153254731016613_6349835994278-1.jpg (http://s1271.photobucket.com/user/seangt83/media/11150213_10153254731016613_6349835994278558690_n_z psdpzfuw2b.jpg.html)

[Water Boy]

Gav is pretty clued up on the turbo rebuilds. I guess you'll send yours down to the Goldcoast to for a rebuild?

It would be really good to get all the trackday VW guys together one time for a fang but its always tricky with $$$, work and time.... maybe next year.

[Machine]

Unfortunately not anymore. Would LOVE to run that track as I didnt when i was down in March. It was on the agenda to go, but currently pulling the turbo off as its got a gremlin inside. I may come for a look depending on my work movements, but will be rollin in a rental car. Will re-aim for later in the year.

You'd be my hero if you took a rental car out onto the track!

[seangti]

Gav is pretty clued up on the turbo rebuilds. I guess you'll send yours down to the Goldcoast to for a rebuild?

It would be really good to get all the trackday VW guys together one time for a fang but its always tricky with $$$, work and time.... maybe next year.

yeah absolutely RE getting all the VW's together. My time will come :-) Fortunately my employer has an office south of Sydney which I spend quite a bit of time at, so anything in or around Sydney I have a reasonable level of flexibility.

And yup, will be taking it back to Billet Turbo's for their diagnostic/rectification. It's undone now, but proving a little difficult to pull it out between the firewall and engine. Will try again tonight when I can get a hand with it.

[seangti]

You'd be my hero if you took a rental car out onto the track!

Sounds like a good idea for a bucks party, or baby shower.... :P

[Machine]

Sounds like a good idea for a bucks party, or baby shower.... :P

Let's do both!

[seangti]

I did timeattack at lakeside yesterday in my daily polo while the red ones off the road. Had an absolutely hoot and got awesome (IMO) lap times given the level of modification. When I last tracked this car at lakeside in March last year with the same/current tyres and no mods done since, I did a 66.0s lap, at the time I thought was pretty good. Yesterday I was lapping consistently in high 64sec, with a best 64.77sec. I've spent quite some time today looking over all my lap data, surprisingly I was much smoother under braking in this car than the red one. The transition between brake and accelerator was much better (I won't bore with that data unless asked). My speeds in the slower corners are only marginally down, cornering forces are mostly comparable, mid corner speeds in the silver car were similar and occasionally better, and my speed coming into hungry was also comparable at around the ~170kph. I've found it really interesting to compare the two cars, both feel and from a data perspective. The red one is faster, more fun but also more challenging and certainly more track oriented, but I wasn't left overly shorthanded with the lesser modded one.

By comparison, the best I've done so far in the red polo is a 63.1sec. I'm confident that I'll be in the 62's with more time in the car, and some work on my braking. And finding the apex of hungry hey Gavin :P

Comparison of Lap times and other data
http://www.vwwatercooled.com.au/forums/images/imported/2015/05/Lap_comparison_zpszulyhhlv-1.jpg (http://s1271.photobucket.com/user/seangt83/media/Lap_comparison_zpszulyhhlv.jpg.html)

Comparison of Sectors of best laps - though my fastest lap in the red polo aren't my sectors bests. I was lapping more consistent in the silver polo than I have in the red. I think that mostly due to the challenge of power down in the red one, whereas the silver car can sit on the floor boards more :-)
http://www.vwwatercooled.com.au/forums/images/imported/2015/05/Sector_Comparison_zpsbb94v2zp-1.jpg (http://s1271.photobucket.com/user/seangt83/media/Sector_Comparison_zpsbb94v2zp.jpg.html)


And AWESOME photo's by Tracktuned Media. Huge thanks for sharing.
http://www.vwwatercooled.com.au/forums/images/imported/2015/05/11119120_496240727208050_579308770831012-1.jpg (http://s1271.photobucket.com/user/seangt83/media/11119120_496240727208050_579308770831012436_o_zpsx tgkw1ad.jpg.html)

http://www.vwwatercooled.com.au/forums/images/imported/2015/05/1973759_496240997208023_7933108760115598-1.jpg (http://s1271.photobucket.com/user/seangt83/media/1973759_496240997208023_7933108760115598361_o_zpso buywhue.jpg.html)

http://www.vwwatercooled.com.au/forums/images/imported/2015/05/11218567_496240813874708_311317953355253-1.jpg (http://s1271.photobucket.com/user/seangt83/media/11218567_496240813874708_3113179533552531636_o_zps o0ns1ct0.jpg.html)

I know I've waffled on here - sorta sorry, but I love this stuff. Plus I hope to look back on this thread in years to come as a bit of a diary... you know when kids are screaming, I'm driving a minivan and wondering what I did with my life. :facepalm: haha.

[h100vw]

It was the only corner I could really see without walking for miles. So maybe you are getting those others wrong too? :D I wonder if some on track footage from a following car would be helpful for refine lines??

It was cool to see all three of you picking up PBs.

Gavin

[nat225]

you have done the silver car a 'driver mod' since March last year :D

[grandturismo]

Congrats on the days results Sean.
Your braking data is interesting to me.
Are there any significant differences in the braking setup between the two cars?
The silver Polo must handle well too, do you feel the differences in setup is money well spent?

[Water Boy]

Enjoy this thread very much!

[louis19]

Really cool to see the comparisons in a total break down, seems like the only real area the red polo has the larger time gain is coming onto the straight as to be expected.

Like you'd already know sometimes more power isn't the key to fast lap times, until your conditioned to the car and understand how and when to apply power, braking, proper lines etc, more power in the wrong hands generally leads to overshooting corners, ending up on the wrong lines and overall actually being slower then if your in a slower car making less mistakes and sticking to the lines. I've raced R/C cars for years, from 1/8th Gas buggies through to 1/10 electric on road cars, and it's the exact same concept. It's only the guys who are more experienced and know how to utilise the power, that then become faster when controlling a higher powered car.

Also people underestimate the ability to produce consistent laps one after the other. Of course you have to be fast aswell but so many times in R/C racing you would see guys with the fastest overall laps for the day but near the back end of the pack overall because they have just done a one hit wonder lap, but then every other lap is 3-4 seconds slower, which over the time of a 10 minute race adds up to nearly a whole extra lap of time.

That bit over 1 sec time difference between the two cars per lap to people may not seem like a lot considering the two cars different mods and power etc but when you get to the pointy end of competition even 0.1 of a second is a lot per lap. Imagine if you were to for argument sake, put the two head to head in a proper race of something like 50 laps, that 1 second difference would nearly accumulate to a whole minute ahead, which in the scheme of thing is a lot. Anyways I won't go on to much.


Off the times in your silver one you can see your driving ability is there, and you know your lines well. It will just be a matter of time before your in the 62's in the red one. Also congrats on beating your PB :banana:

[seangti]

hi, cheers for the responses.

Gavin, I didn't record this one, though my lines are typically very similar to Nat's, and Alan's. I think we're all running very similar now, though it's about refining and finding those 10ths. Which is also why I've started looking at distance travelled per lap, as 10metres at 170kph (47.2 metres per second) is 0.211 seconds. Gotta find them 10ths.

Alan, regarding brakes. The silver polo is standard calipers with DBA T2 rotors front and rear with Bendix pads on the front and remsa on the rear. They certainly look and feel worse for wear today. The red polo has Brembo's front with 320mm T2 rotor's, rears are off upsized and vented (250mm) with braided lines, remsa pads front and rear I think. The red polo feels much stronger under brakes. Now it has QFM A1RM's, I'm expecting better performance.

I wasn't sure how best to illustrate the differences, so have tried a screen shot with overlay straight from the Gtech software.
Points A: braking. Longitudinal force is braking (-ve g's) and acceleration (+ve g's). The black lines and data are from the silver polo, the red for the red. This one graph is actually some of my better braking in the red car. Note the y-axis is for time, rather than distance, so it will be skewed a bit due to speed. Anyway, at the "A", you can see the red line isn't as progressive/linear as the black. I'm having 2 go's under braking. I'm guessing that I'm out braking myself, so letting off, than getting back on the brakes (albeit very marginally in this graph). I'm also braking harder (more g's) in the silver car. It's the same at the second "A", but more evident.

Point B: I'm looking at how progressing that line is as I get back on the throttle. This in accelerating out of Hungry. I have to run 4th gear in the red polo as it's wheel spun, the silver car is 3rd gear, but not full throttle as that'll spin a bit too. But the line is much more progressing. I'm also interested in the lateral acceleration (turning), which the black line is also much smoother.

Pont C: This is the turn at the bus stop, just as you tip in under the bridge. Surprisingly, the speed between both cars is essentially identical at just over 150kph. As is peak speed coming into Hungry at ~170kph. The red line (red car), gets there sooner, and post corner accelerates much quicker, but peak cornering speeds/loads are very similar. On this lap in this corner, I'm also braking harder in the silver car at -0.86g's compared to maxing the red car at -0.7g's.

Given the red car has much more chassis tweaking; bushes, shims, camber/castor kit, corner weighted, coilovers, lots of bracing, I'm really quite surprised how close the data appears. In terms of feel, the red car is better, front end feel in the corners is better, braking feels better, but it doesn't look like I'm getting all that out of the car yet. In Karousel and Eastern Loop, there's nothing in it, if anything I'm doing better in the silver car... I wonder if it's just needing more time in the red one to get a handle on the power, or is it too much power with an open diff...

http://www.vwwatercooled.com.au/forums/images/imported/2015/05/GPS_v2_zps3tvi5yz4png-1.jpg (http://s1271.photobucket.com/user/seangt83/media/GPS_v2_zps3tvi5yz4.png.html)


Louis, thanks for the your input mate. It's hard to put chasing 10th's into perspective until your doing it hey. Will we see you out there? :-)

[Machine]

I want this data analysis for my laps! How much to hire you, Sean?

[seangti]

I want this data analysis for my laps! How much to hire you, Sean?
You can't afford me, pal [emoji3]

It's yours when its not mine, though the vbox software is more detailed and would save a lot of time from having to collate data in excel.

[louis19]

Yeah it's easy to make speculations and suggestions from the sidelines, totally different story putting it all into action out there. Like most things, easier said then done :P

I do want to get into some time attack days but there's still a few more things I want to do on the car before then. Until then, happy laps days are entertaining enough to keep me assumed.

[seangti]

Ok, so the turbo is knackered on the red car, seals and turbine shaft are shat and I'm unsure of getting it rebuilt and lasting. Looking at Frankenturbo F21 at the moment, just started bouncing some emails. Also looked at Beach Buggy turbo's in the UK, though the lead time suggested on their site is longer than I want to be without, and I don't have any access to local knowledge/reviews of their gear. I'm open to any other recommendations. I'm not overly chasing a power figure, it just must be able to withstand track work.

I'm also tempted to go back to standard turbo, if anyone hears of one in good condition please let me know.

:mad:

[vwthunder]

I think for the price the Frankenturbo is your best bet, apart from beach buggy or there is also Gonzo and FTG (for the gusto)

I have only heard of 1 Frankenturbo failing and it was more so user error, Gonzo i heard a few people are using but not much customer support/communication, basically a copy of Frankenturbo and FTG, well i have no idea but seems too cheap (maybe worth a try)

Billet K04 001 MK4 VW Turbo 1 8T EO5 50mm Compressor Jetta Golf GTI KO4 001 2yr | eBay (http://www.ebay.com/itm/BILLET-K04-001-mk4-VW-Turbo-1-8T-EO5-50mm-COMPRESSOR-JETTA-GOLF-GTi-KO4-001-2yr-/301185310221?vxp=mtr&hash=item46200b1e0d)

GTTx-052 Hybrid Turbocharger Kit - K03 Fitment (http://tunedbygts.com/hardware/vw-hw/mk4-hw/gttx-052)

[Stuwey]

I'd be leaning toward a Garrett or maybe a OEM type K04 as a direct bolt-up.

[vwthunder]

I'd be leaning toward a Garrett or maybe a OEM type K04 as a direct bolt-up.

Garrett would be too expensive to fit up, new downpipe, manifold, TIP, rods, tune, your basically starting again.
OEM K04 would cost around the same or more than a Frankenturbo

[vwthunder]

Show your face Gavin :P

Has he given you any ideas Sean ?

[seangti]

Show your face Gavin :P

Has he given you any ideas Sean ?


Haha, yeah I called Gavin immediately after hearing of the condition of my turbo. Needed counselling.

Just got a quote from Frankenturbo, looking at over US$1500... This sh** is breaking my spirit.

So who wants a red polo for parts??

[h100vw]

I gave him the 3 options. BBT looks ok, but can't look past FTG assuming it doesn't fly apart first time you start it. FT pricey

Gavin

[vwthunder]

Haha, yeah I called Gavin immediately after hearing of the condition of my turbo. Needed counselling.

Just got a quote from Frankenturbo, looking at over US$1500... This sh** is breaking my spirit.

So who wants a red polo for parts??

I added the Frankenturbo in my cart and it came to $1099, I would see if you can just get the turbo without the TIP and the manifold. I am still using the stock OEM manifold, i sold the Frankenturbo one as the casting did not look very smooth

I would love some parts from your car but i think i have everything already lol

[Eddy]

Hoyhoy.

Ko4.
Physically the same as the stocker.

[seangti]

Hoyhoy.

Ko4.
Physically the same as the stocker.

Thanks Eddy. Any idea where to source one? Curious on pricing too.

I've learnt more today, read forums, spoke to another turbo builder and been back in contact with the original builder of the turbo. Due to prices, I may end up rebuilding. Any other turbo option exceeds the rebuild cost by a not insignificant amount, plus the risk of buying overseas and something going wrong, incurring the shipping costs or simply not having that avenue, IMO exceeds the 'risk' of rebuilding and having the builder a phone call away. Gotta be logical about it and take a balanced approach. Anyway, still looking at my options before jumping the gun.

As always, all input is appreciated.

[Eddy]

Hoyhoy.





Thanks Eddy. Any idea where to source one? Curious on pricing too.





I'm also tempted to go back to standard turbo, if anyone hears of one in good condition please let me know.

:mad:

Why go back to standard.
I'm not too update on things Sean, just had a quick look on google.
I had mine coming loose for a while, then reinforced the brackets & welded the studs together along with the APR tune.
That was years ago & haven't touched that part since, even with tracking hard.

K04 001 VW Turbo 1 8T EO5 50mm Compressor Jetta Golf GTI K04 001 KO4 | eBay (http://www.ebay.com/itm/K04-001-VW-Turbo-1-8T-EO5-50mm-COMPRESSOR-JETTA-GOLF-GTi-K04-001-KO4-/301031129543)

[seangti]

Hoyhoy.



Why go back to standard.
I'm not too update on things Sean, just had a quick look on google.
I had mine coming loose for a while, then reinforced the brackets & welded the studs together along with the APR tune.
That was years ago & haven't touched that part since, even with tracking hard.

K04 001 VW Turbo 1 8T EO5 50mm Compressor Jetta Golf GTI K04 001 KO4 | eBay (http://www.ebay.com/itm/K04-001-VW-Turbo-1-8T-EO5-50mm-COMPRESSOR-JETTA-GOLF-GTi-K04-001-KO4-/301031129543)
Oh, that's an FTG Motorsports turbo. Yeah they are much cheaper hey, half the price of the rebuild, quarter of a new. I've only seen a few reviews on Audi's, though the turbos are only 6-9months old.

The reason for my comment about going back to standard is that they are reliable and I was thinking cheaper, but I could only see one for $750 odd. But didn't search much as yet. Than factor in retune and change over injectors, better to stick with rebuild and perhaps take some power out of it in the interests of heat management, longevity and reliability.

It doesn't appear that all k04-001's are the right fitment for the polo, is that correct? In some of the pics I've seen, the orientation didn't look right?

[Water Boy]

What is your current turbo that needs rebuilding?

[h100vw]

What is your current turbo that needs rebuilding?

Same as mine Woody. The Billet one

[Eddy]

Hoyhoy.

Hmm, yeah I see that Borg Warner is quite a bit dearer.
Like I say I'm not up to date on things.

[h100vw]

Sean, K04-001 is transverse fitment. K04-023 is for the TT/S3 and the exhaust exits sideways so the downpipe can clear the propshaft.

Gavin

[seangti]

Sean, K04-001 is transverse fitment. K04-023 is for the TT/S3 and the exhaust exits sideways so the downpipe can clear the propshaft.

Gavin


Excellent. As always mate, really appreciate your input and assistance.

[h100vw]

Excellent. As always mate, really appreciate your input and assistance.

I forgot the K04-015 for the longitudinal motors in the Passats and A4s. Again very different to a 001.

Gavin

[grandturismo]

I have a GT2860R with all the APR stage 3 hardware in a box, if only!!

[seangti]

I have a GT2860R with all the APR stage 3 hardware in a box, if only!!

That's what keeps me looking at the mkVI's mate. Depending how all this goes... we'll see.

[nat225]

:idea: scirocco r.. (coughing).. wider wheel base... (coughing)... 3 door... (coughing) low COG... :cool:

[Machine]

Thanks Eddy. Any idea where to source one? Curious on pricing too.

There's one on my car.
I'll go bigger :)

[Machine]

:idea: scirocco r.. (coughing).. wider wheel base... (coughing)... 3 door... (coughing) low COG... :cool:

LOL. Why don't you get one, Nat?

[nat225]

LOL. Why don't you get one, Nat?

hey get back to your holiday! :)

stay away from the forums, then you will be back here all fresh.