Help.. ABS, ESP then Steering and tyres warning lights on 2006 Polo GTI

[sikman]

Hi Team

Purchased this car last week and has been faultless until yesterday, started car to go out and immediately felt something weird under brakes and looked up and saw ABS & and ESP light on. This happened twice and later in the day when driving home it all went away

Then this morning when driving son to school and slowed down to pull into the driveway I lost steering, it went rock hard and could barely turn, I ended up using all my strength to turn the wheel and drove up and parked it. Came back 5 minutes later and same deal I could barely turn wheel and had Steering & tyre warning lights on... So I drive it home and left it there, too dangerous to drive..

I have an ebay ODB II diagnostic plug that I used on my last car Evo 7 but I thought I try it on the polo, it connects and starts to pull codes and display's NO FAULTS stored on ECU, most probably need a VAGCOM one to getthe codes off??

Not happy at the moment, any one experience this or know who should I contact, I'm at South Sydney area, Sans Souci / Rockdale area...

[Paazuzu]

Hi Team

Purchased this car last week and has been faultless until yesterday, started car to go out and immediately felt something weird under brakes and looked up and saw ABS & and ESP light on. This happened twice and later in the day when driving home it all went away

Then this morning when driving son to school and slowed down to pull into the driveway I lost steering, it went rock hard and could barely turn, I ended up using all my strength to turn the wheel and drove up and parked it. Came back 5 minutes later and same deal I could barely turn wheel and had Steering & tyre warning lights on... So I drive it home and left it there, too dangerous to drive..

I have an ebay ODB II diagnostic plug that I used on my last car Evo 7 but I thought I try it on the polo, it connects and starts to pull codes and display's NO FAULTS stored on ECU, most probably need a VAGCOM one to getthe codes off??

Not happy at the moment, any one experience this or know who should I contact, I'm at South Sydney area, Sans Souci / Rockdale area...

I'm in the same boat sikman! This happened to me last week (see my previous post -> http://www.vwwatercooled.com.au/forums/f127/electrical-issue-abs-esp-power-steering-light-coming-randomly-94166.html). It hasn't happened since, which is weird.

The forum mentions the battery/fuses/grounding issues. I'm not sure where to start either.

[sikman]

Hopefully we can find a fix for this until then I can't drive the car as its too dangerous as with my case I lose steering and goes stiff and needs gorilla strength to turn the wheel, imagine driving around a bend and it goes crazy I will cross into the oncoming traffic head on... So far it's happened twice but at low speeds so I'm pretty lucky..

I will first check wires/grounding, etc and then visit VAG specialist to see if they can fault find it

[The_Hawk]

OBDII is pretty standard, if your scanner says no errors there probably isn't... although that doesn't sound quite right.

[brad]

On my Octavia I had the ESP & steering lights come on & eventually got the heavy steering - it's not that dangerous except for parking. I drove for a few hundred km with it heavy - wish I could get the weighting halfway between stock & broken.

Anyway this thread may help (http://www.vwwatercooled.com.au/forums/f149/flat-battery-now-steering-heavy-92883.html). Possibly your battery is on the way out. 11.6V seems to be the magic figure.

You can borrow my VCDS cable if you want. I'm just at Carss Park

[flat6]

Brad may be right, had similar symptoms on my car when trying to jump start a dead flat battery, no power steering with flashing traction and abs lights on the dash, hit the battery with a multimeter and see what voltage its sitting at with the engine off, should be well over 11.5v

[brad]

If the vehicle is 2009 or older & still on the origibal unit then it would be the first place I'd look. Sure, do all the earthing clean-up, etc as it won't hurt.

At rest with no load it should be about 2.1v per cell (12.6v) after the battery has been sitting idle for 24hrs. If it's just off the charger or after a decent run it might well be over 13v.

If you want to get it checked then Batteries Direct at Penshurst should be able to test it & if it's faulty & needs replacement their prices are excellent & they carry Varta batteries which are great.

I assume the vehicle is out of warranty so no point trying to make a battery claim at dealers.

[h100vw]

The power steering is electric and power comes through a fuse on the top of the battery, Check they are all intact.

Gavin

[sikman]

On my Octavia I had the ESP & steering lights come on & eventually got the heavy steering - it's not that dangerous except for parking. I drove for a few hundred km with it heavy - wish I could get the weighting halfway between stock & broken.

Anyway this thread may help (http://www.vwwatercooled.com.au/forums/f149/flat-battery-now-steering-heavy-92883.html). Possibly your battery is on the way out. 11.6V seems to be the magic figure.

You can borrow my VCDS cable if you want. I'm just at Carss Park

thanks for the tip, I checked my battery this morning and its showing 12.5-6

If its not too much problem I would like to use your VCDS cable, I will send you a PM

[sikman]

The power steering is electric and power comes through a fuse on the top of the battery, Check they are all intact.

Gavin

I checked the fuses and they are seem fine, I pulled them out and checked.

As tested battery is 12.5-6 with car turned off and It looks like it was replaced be the previous owner as I can see an NRMA logo on it

[sikman]

More updates:

1. Battery test 11.5-6 at rest

2. Start car and let it run for 5 minutes and tested battery at approx 13 volts

3. Turned steering wheel hard left and right and a few times and steering light, abs, esp, handbrake light all ON and wheel heavy

4. While in above state tested battery and around 12.6-8 and then every 1-2 minutes the car almost stalls with volts down to 11.6-8 then back to around 12.6-8.

5. While all this is going on I can hear and feel through the body of the car a THUD THUD every 1-2 seconds constantly and a TICK/electrical noise like a short/maybe relay?? as well somewhere near the back/right side of the motor

6. Drove the car around the block a few times until steering wheel went back to normal and battery is reading around 13 volts

[brad]

Battery sounds sick. Maybe still under warranty if recently replaced.

[Paazuzu]

Hopefully it's just the battery sikman.

I'll have to get a new multimeter to check my battery - lost power steering on Saturday night (only a short drive home thankfully) and it hasn't happened since. Checked all fuses (top of battery and drivers side) but everything seems ok.

Quick question - am I missing a fuse on the top of the battery or is this normal? See pic.

7906

[h100vw]

Hopefully it's just the battery sikman.

I'll have to get a new multimeter to check my battery - lost power steering on Saturday night (only a short drive home thankfully) and it hasn't happened since. Checked all fuses (top of battery and drivers side) but everything seems ok.

Quick question - am I missing a fuse on the top of the battery or is this normal? See pic.

7906

Flick up the black cover next to those blade fuses, where you'll find some high amp ones with 10mm nuts on each end. These are often broken, hairline cracks, causing intermittent failures.

Gavin

[Guy_H]

Normally this problem is the power steering (pump) unit - internal short pulls the voltage down on that entire bus. If you check the wiring diagram, you will see that is the first point the voltage passes through.

I would almost bet beer on it.

[Paazuzu]

Flick up the black cover next to those blade fuses, where you'll find some high amp ones with 10mm nuts on each end. These are often broken, hairline cracks, causing intermittent failures.

Gavin

Thanks Gav - will check it out ASAP. Want to get this sorted before I see you for a stage 1 tune!

[Paazuzu]

Normally this problem is the power steering (pump) unit - internal short pulls the voltage down on that entire bus. If you check the wiring diagram, you will see that is the first point the voltage passes through.

I would almost bet beer on it.

Betting beer on it eh? That's a big call :)

I'll check the fuses then will get someone to look at the pump for me.

[brad]

Sikman came & picked up the VCDS cable at my place tonight. We did a quick scan & it has many codes which he saved as a txt file. Maybe he can post it here for further diagnosis.

I'm pretty sure most of them are collateral to whatever the main problem is. The battery is a fairly new NRMA unit but that doesn't mean much.

Voltage pulls down to 10.6v at start-up with headlights on.

I'm also thinking he should clear the codes & see what comes back now he has scanned them but maybe that's not the smartest idea?

[sikman]

First off I must thank Brad for lending me his VAGCOM cable, met him last night top bloke and very helpful and knowledgeable..

I will post all my codes below, when I got home last night I cleared the codes and drove around the block 3 times, stopped and turned steering hard lock left and right multiple times, stop and started car again, hit some roundabouts, etc and then checked for codes and nothing came up beside 1 errors ""01596 - Motor for Outside/Recirculated Air Flap (V154) " my aircon works on all speeds and cool air comes out...

I also drove the car to work today and so far trouble free.

I rang up NRMA and spoke to the tech and he reckons 99% that its got something to do with the alternator/wiring to it as when the car is running it should be up in the 14V range but my car is lucky to see 13V max

Codes:
Monday,24,February,2014,19:30:24:29321
VCDS -- Windows Based VAG/VAS Emulator
VCDS Version: 12.12.0.0
Data version: 20130910


VIN: WVWZZZ9NZ6Y178012 License Plate: NXM26G
Mileage: 83470km-51865mi Repair Order:



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Chassis Type: 9N (9N - VW Polo (2002 > 2010))
Scan: 01 02 03 08 09 15 17 19 25 37 44 45 46 56 76

VIN: WVWZZZ9NZ6Y17XXXX Mileage: 83470km/51865miles
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 01: Engine Labels: None
Part No: 06A 906 032 TL
Component: 1.8l R4/5VT G 0040
Coding: 11500
Shop #: WSC 00788
VCID: 7BFE656B6997E9C6C11-513C
WVWZZZ9NZ6Y17XXXX VWZ7Z0F3286050

3 Faults Found:
17936 - Camshaft Timing Adj. Bank1 (N205)
P1528 - 35-10 - Open Circuit - Intermittent
17840 - Secondary Air Injection Solenoid Valve (N112)
P1432 - 35-10 - Open Circuit - Intermittent
17695 - Boost Pressure Control Valve (N249)
P1287 - 35-10 - Open Circuit - Intermittent
Readiness: 0000 0000

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 03: ABS Brakes Labels: None
Part No SW: 6Q0 907 379 AR HW: 6Q0 907 379 AR
Component: ESP 8.0 front H02 0002
Revision: 00000000 Serial number: 00000000000000
Coding: 0000269
Shop #: WSC 00788 785 00200
VCID: 8D1ABBB3972357766F5-513C

2 Faults Found:
01201 - ABS Pump Supply Voltage
000 - - - Intermittent
Freeze Frame:
Fault Status: 00100000
Fault Priority: 1
Fault Frequency: 2
Reset counter: 203
Mileage: 83440 km
Time Indication: 0

00532 - Supply Voltage B+
002 - Lower Limit Exceeded - Intermittent
Freeze Frame:
Fault Status: 00100010
Fault Priority: 3
Fault Frequency: 2
Reset counter: 203
Mileage: 83462 km
Time Indication: 0


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 08: Auto HVAC Labels: 6Q0-820-045.lbl
Part No: 6Q0 820 045
Component: Klimaanlage X0840
VCID: EAD0D02F960DE04EAA7-513C

1 Fault Found:
01596 - Motor for Outside/Recirculated Air Flap (V154)
30-10 - Open or Short to Plus - Intermittent

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 09: Cent. Elect. Labels: 6Qx-937-049-C.lbl
Part No: 6Q1 937 049 D
Component: 00BK BN-SG. 1S34
Coding: 25742
Shop #: WSC 00788
VCID: 3C7CA6772C192EFE88B-513C

2 Faults Found:
01309 - Power Steering Control Module (J500)
49-10 - No Communications - Intermittent
01598 - Drive Battery Voltage
07-10 - Signal too Low - Intermittent

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 15: Airbags Labels: 6Q0-909-605-VW5.lbl
Part No: 1C0 909 605 F
Component: 26 AIRBAG VW61 0N06 0003
Coding: 12854
Shop #: WSC 00788
VCID: 2756691BC59F9D26F59-513C

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 17: Instruments Labels: 6Q0-920-xxx-17.lbl
Part No: 6Q0 920 823 N
Component: KOMBI+WEGFAHRSP VDO V02
Coding: 03744
Shop #: WSC 00000
VCID: 3D7AAB73370327F6BF5-513C
WVWZZZ9NZ6Y178012 VWZ7Z0F3286050

1 Fault Found:
01309 - Power Steering Control Module (J500)
49-10 - No Communications - Intermittent

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 19: CAN Gateway Labels: 6N0-909-901-19.lbl
Part No: 6N0 909 901
Component: 0B7L GATEWAY CAN 1S34
Coding: 00014
Shop #: WSC 00788
VCID: F0E4C247B0D11A9EE43-513C

1 Fault Found:
01309 - Power Steering Control Module (J500)
49-10 - No Communications - Intermittent

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 44: Steering Assist Labels: 6Q0-423-156.clb
Part No: 6Q0 423 156 AB
Component: LenkhilfeTRW V270
Coding: 10120
Shop #: WSC 00788
VCID: 6FE6413B2DEF85667D9-513C

2 Faults Found:
00566 - Steering Assistance Operation
27-10 - Implausible Signal - Intermittent
01288 - Terminal 30; Steering Assist
07-10 - Signal too Low - Intermittent

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 45: Inter. Monitor Labels: 6Q0-951-171.lbl
Part No: 6Q0 951 171 C
Component: Innenraumueberw. 0020
VCID: 3260884FFE5DE88E527-513C

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 46: Central Conv. Labels: 6Q0-959-433.lbl
Part No: 6Q0 959 433 E
Component: 63 Komfortgerát 0002
Coding: 00016
Shop #: WSC 00788
VCID: 3D7AAB73370327F6BF5-4B00

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 56: Radio Labels: 1K0-035-1xx-56.lbl
Part No SW: 6Q0 035 152 A HW: 6Q0 035 152 A
Component: Radio BVX 005 0004
Revision: 00005000 Serial number: VWZ1Z5F8988225
Coding: 0040400
Shop #: WSC 00788 785 00200
VCID: 28546A279881925EFC3-513C

No fault code found.

End ---------------------------------------------------------------------

[sikman]

Update:

Went out and tested battery again and now for some reason while car is running battery volts are back to around 14V....not sure what to think now as previously it would only go to 13V max

[h100vw]

Update:

Went out and tested battery again and now for some reason while car is running battery volts are back to around 14V....not sure what to think now as previously it would only go to 13V max

Current that the alternator is putting out is an important factor that lots of folk over look. It could be there was a big short like Guy believes. If the draw is hard enough voltage will drop.

Most of those codes look like a flat battery could have caused them. Maybe the alternator isn't as good as it could be, duff rectifier or a high resistance in the circuit that you were measuring through, skewing the results. A bad earth or battery clamp??

[sikman]

Normally this problem is the power steering (pump) unit - internal short pulls the voltage down on that entire bus. If you check the wiring diagram, you will see that is the first point the voltage passes through.

I would almost bet beer on it.

It might be as bad as Guy_H is describing, will continue to investigate....

Bad news, came home from work today, turned hard right to get into driveway and then back hard left to reverse out and guess what, power steering went funny again, I could also hear a pump noise and a thud thud thud constant noise pulsing, turned car off and back on again and it cleared. Will pull error codes later.

[CJHOOKR]

Bit busy at work at the moment to go into detail but a similar thing happened to me last week, lights on the dash came on while driving so I pulled over immediately and turned the car off and on to find they were still there. Turned the car off, fiddled with the battery and let it sit for 5 mins... turned the key again and clock had been reset but otherwise was back to normal until I got home where it happened to me again. Hasn't happened since though.

I'm going to start by replacing the Earth strap after reading this:

http://www.vwwatercooled.com.au/forums/f127/electrical-gremlins-%3D-faulty-ignition-switch-70962.html

[Jmac]

The alt to batt positive cable can get brittle and cause resistance which can also cause dramas. Allsorts of stuff can cause this , with the diagram you can check what all the open circuit faults are and you will find they are all linked to a common source. Ah my favourite type of faults. Anyway good luck

Jmac

[sikman]

More updates:
Loss of electric assistance Steering and most lights on the dash still coming on, its really hard to turn full lock to pull out of a parking space, it was intermittent before every few days but now it happens all the time, yesterday I drove home for 30mins with no power steering, that was fun.

New issues and new fault has comes up, while stopped at Red lights the car engine will hesitate and then BOOM everything is cut off and lose all ignition/engine, quick flick of the key and back to idle, has happened 3 times since yesterday.

When car is in a SPASTIC state I check battery volts and its at 12.8V, turn key off then back on again car starts with no errors and now has 14V. Something is pulling voltages down on the system to cause all these errors, and when it gets bad will pull enuff to shutdown the whole car.

I've also noticed that when it shuts down my Trip meter reset back to 0km, Will be taking car to my mechanics today for a full inspection of electrical wiring, earth, fuses, etc.....

Also new code appearing:
Address 46: Central Conv. Labels: 6Q0-959-433.lbl
Part No: 6Q0 959 433 E
Component: 63 Komfortgerát 0002
Coding: 00016
Shop #: WSC 00788
VCID: 3D7AAB73370327F6BF5-4B00


1 Fault Found:
00849 - S-contact at Ignition/Starter Switch (D)
25-10 - Unknown Switch Condition - Intermittent

[sikman]

Bit busy at work at the moment to go into detail but a similar thing happened to me last week, lights on the dash came on while driving so I pulled over immediately and turned the car off and on to find they were still there. Turned the car off, fiddled with the battery and let it sit for 5 mins... turned the key again and clock had been reset but otherwise was back to normal until I got home where it happened to me again. Hasn't happened since though.

I'm going to start by replacing the Earth strap after reading this:

http://www.vwwatercooled.com.au/forums/f127/electrical-gremlins-%3D-faulty-ignition-switch-70962.html

Hey, thanks for the link, that guys issues are almost exactly like mine, will check ignition switch first since I got that error but will look at checking/replacing the earth strap

[Paazuzu]

Hey, thanks for the link, that guys issues are almost exactly like mine, will check ignition switch first since I got that error but will look at checking/replacing the earth strap

Hey sikman

Did you end up sorting this issue out?

[brad]

snap!
Was only wondering about it on the commute in this morning. Wouldn't mind getting my cable back as I've got some TPMS fiddling I want to try out.

[sikman]

Hey sikman

Did you end up sorting this issue out?

No, car is at mechanics for the last 2 weeks but he has not touched it yet, busy busy and plus he is my friend :-(

[sikman]

snap!
Was only wondering about it on the commute in this morning. Wouldn't mind getting my cable back as I've got some TPMS fiddling I want to try out.

I call you today to organise return of cable back to you

[sikman]

Update:

Got the car back yesterday and all is fine, Mechanic has driven the car around for most of the week and clocked up 165KM and Ive done around 60km and trouble free so far as before it was f**king up everytime you drove it constantly.

The Fix: Removed and cleaned/sanded all earthing points, removed all wiring plugs that connect to steering/pump and sprayed them with Electrical Cleaner.

Fingers crossed it seems to be fixed. Over 200KM of driving incident free while before it would happen everytime you started the car....

[Robi Kan]

Hey Sikman (and Paazuzu)
I have the exact same problem! I have sent the car to the shop with your notes. Hope it will be solved :)

Thanks alot.

Robi.
-----------------------------
2006 9N3 1.4 Auto (Black)
_________________________

[sikman]

Robi

Its been 1 month now and well over 1000km off trouble free driving, I hope my fix will work for you as well. Let me know how it goes.

[Paazuzu]

Thanks for posting this Sikman. My car has started having some real issues over the past week - so will give this a crack on the weekend.

[Paazuzu]

Update:

Got the car back yesterday and all is fine, Mechanic has driven the car around for most of the week and clocked up 165KM and Ive done around 60km and trouble free so far as before it was f**king up everytime you drove it constantly.

The Fix: Removed and cleaned/sanded all earthing points, removed all wiring plugs that connect to steering/pump and sprayed them with Electrical Cleaner.

Fingers crossed it seems to be fixed. Over 200KM of driving incident free while before it would happen everytime you started the car....

Spent a few hours today doing this. Man what a pain in the butt getting the battery out! Who at VW thought up that monstrosity of a battery cover!!? Anyhow, cleaned, sanded and greased all earth points and sprayed the power steering connections with electrical cleaner. Took her for a 20 minute test drive and so far, so good. Hope it stays that way!

[gavs]

I hate to laugh at you guys and you missfortune but VW have had notoriously bad history with electrics and specifically, earth points. Good to see they STILL haven't sorted themselves out.

Good job with your mate figuring out the issue sikman, lesson for all fairly new vw owners. If you have anything crazy going on with your electrics, undo and clean all your major earth points:)

[Paazuzu]

Quick update - over 1000k's now and still no issues.

[sikman]

Quick update - over 1000k's now and still no issues.

Good to hear my trick also is working for you as well, I'm now 3 months trouble free so to me that means it was a successfully resolution... If the car went to VW for troubleshooting they would of replaced battery, steering pump, steering rack, etc $5000++ later it would still have the "Earth problem"..

[Bundy]

Robi

Its been 1 month now and well over 1000km off trouble free driving, I hope my fix will work for you as well. Let me know how it goes.

sikman, I know this thread is ancient but just wondering how much longer did the vehicle last on the cleaned earth points? Did the issue ever come back? My wife has a 2008 VW POLO GTI that is experiencing the exact issues that you described and she had the alternator replaced only to still have the issue still exist. Just curious how much longer the hassle free driving continued for post the earth cleansing?

Cheers,

Bundy

[seangti]

sikman, I know this thread is ancient but just wondering how much longer did the vehicle last on the cleaned earth points? Did the issue ever come back? My wife has a 2008 VW POLO GTI that is experiencing the exact issues that you described and she had the alternator replaced only to still have the issue still exist. Just curious how much longer the hassle free driving continued for post the earth cleansing?

Cheers,

Bundy

That person hasn't been here in years. Clean the earth contact patch on the chassis, or even replace the earth cable too. It should last ages/many years, usually just caused by surface corrosion if the contact patch turns poor. Pending your issue, the main fuses on the top of the battery can get very fine hair line cracks in them, you'd need a torch and a keen eye to spot it sometimes, that can/do fail and cause some gremlins. Running a multi meter probably won't identify it.

Clean the earth points, have a keen look over the fuses. Without going back over the thread (sorry, lazy), the power steering, oil sensor and I think ABS all run off the same fuse. Perhaps check the wiring diagram and follow the trail pending your fault.