SEAT Ibiza Cupra 20VT Build Thread

[Golf Loon]

So, I`m sure lots of you saw the 20VT Ibiza that was up in Brissie and was sadly T Boned and destroyed.

My mate Dave, Ibeezer bought the wreck and we parked it at my workshop.

Dave currently owns a 16v Ibiza Cuprasport and has been going on about how laggy and slow it is for as long as I have known him. The Brissie Cupra was running, but the conversion is a bit untidy and the intercooler is very obvious. Dave wants the stealth, stock look. Steel black wheels and stock exterior are the plan.

The basic plan was to remove the 16v Engine, Gearbox and Loom with coded key and ecu in such a way that it can be used in another car.

We will then remove the engine, box and loom from the 20v and put it into Daves Cupra. Thats the plan anyway.

Work began by removing the dash from both cars! Phew and the front ends.

We complicated the issue by having decided to swop the A Arms for VR6 spec widetrack items, along with swaybar, driveshafts and 5 stud conversion.

Dav insisted on using new nolathane bushes throughout, new inner and outer cvs, new wheelbearings and new pads and rotors. This slowed us down a little, as did having new bearings pushed into two RHS hubs! :D

The loom was tricky to remove, requiring removal of the heater box. Not a problem on the wreck, but more of an issue of the one we want to put back together. It took 2 days to unthread both looms and 20 mins to plug it all in!

Close of play yesterday had the 20VT sitting in its new home, wiring plugged into the fusebox, but not the starter and the front still not on the car.

Pics :

http://www.vwwatercooled.com.au/forums/images/imported/2007/09/100_0900-4.jpg

http://www.vwwatercooled.com.au/forums/images/imported/2007/09/100_0901-4.jpg

[DUB 20V]

wow thats going to flyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy :):):):)

[Golf Loon]

http://www.vwwatercooled.com.au/forums/images/imported/2007/09/100_0902-4.jpg

http://www.vwwatercooled.com.au/forums/images/imported/2007/09/100_0903-4.jpg

[gpk_gti]

now this is a hot build up!!! good work guys!!!:D

[aprr32]

Nice work, conversions are always fun, but I'd get rid of that poxy Ryco oil filer and put on a German one that actually designed to work.

[Golf Loon]

Nice work, conversions are always fun, but I'd get rid of that poxy Ryco oil filer and put on a German one that actually designed to work.

Yeah good point. The filter is going, we havent changed the oil yet.

I need to clear the workshop of the wreck. i have 3 black Cupras in there atm :???:

[rayray086]

Well done Matt, last I saw of it the 20VT was still in the donor!

[IbizaGTI]

wow, that engine looks nothing like what I have in my Ibiza - looks like wires and pipes going everywhere... I'd half expect it to get up and transform and roll out...
were 20VT's sold in Oz? I thought the last ones sold here were the 99 16v cupras

[Golf Loon]

No 20VT Ibizas were sold in Oz. The last ones were 99 Model 16v Cupras, all 52 of em!

The original conversion was done in Brissie and has a Golf 4 engine and QPEng loom, all we are really doing is transferring all that stuff into a new shell, but thats pretty involved still.

[gpk_gti]

No 20VT Ibizas were sold in Oz. The last ones were 99 Model 16v Cupras, all 52 of em!



and loon has personally worked on or wrecked 50 of them!!!:D

matt ! the god of SEAT!!!!!!!!!!!!:cool:

[99gti]

Good work guys, this is going to be a great conversion to keep a keen eye on.

[Oneofthegreats]

Nice work there loon & Ibeezer.

Will be keeping tabs on this one. I suppose it's more of just swapping everything over than having to do the conversion & modifying etc. The hard work has already been done.
This machine will honk along very nicely.

I see that Dave had to mark the car Loon (Front support). Maybe he thinks that you just might swap something over one night when he's not looking Loon!;)

[Golf Loon]

Nice work there loon & Ibeezer.

Will be keeping tabs on this one. I suppose it's more of just swapping everything over than having to do the conversion & modifying etc. The hard work has already been done.
This machine will honk along very nicely.

I see that Dave had to mark the car Loon (Front support). Maybe he thinks that you just might swap something over one night when he's not looking Loon!;)

LOL Mate. I have 3 cupras at the shop and they are all black. Confusing.
Dave has put all new bushes on the subframe etc.

Its been interesting to see that there is a range of Cupras that have a different subframes to the others. Its 40mm shorter on the drivers side and has different mounting positions. Very unusual to find such a quirk in the VW world. Its the Late 99 ones that have gone wider, perhaps for the impending 20V that Seat had in the pipeline :???:

Yeah easier to swop everything over, but still a lot of work, especially as Dave is hoping for daily driver reliability!!

[peedman]

hehehe that looks awesome, that should fly!

do u mind me asking whats happening to the 16v????

[Golf Loon]

hehehe that looks awesome, that should fly!

do u mind me asking whats happening to the 16v????

Sold man, going into an Ibiza GTI.

[Golf Loon]

Moving ahead with this project.
Put wheels on it today and it now rolls.

It has VR6 widetrack suspension, 5 stud conversion, nolathane throughout and new discs, cvs, bearings and pads.

The wheels look phat. I`ll post a pic pretty soon.

[Golf Loon]

5 Stud VR6 conversion with lots of new bits

http://www.vwwatercooled.com.au/forums/images/imported/2007/09/100_0945-1.jpg

http://www.vwwatercooled.com.au/forums/images/imported/2007/09/100_0946-1.jpg

Dave putting the wheel on

http://www.vwwatercooled.com.au/forums/images/imported/2007/09/100_0962-1.jpg

[Golf Loon]

Stealth Chaser Look

http://www.vwwatercooled.com.au/forums/images/imported/2007/09/100_0964-1.jpg

http://www.vwwatercooled.com.au/forums/images/imported/2007/09/100_0966-1.jpg


And widetrack VR6 business

http://www.vwwatercooled.com.au/forums/images/imported/2007/09/100_0969-1.jpg

[GoLfMan]

SWEEET im loving the stealth look :)

[GermanwithaVdub]

ohhhh man that thing looks PHAT!!!

[99gti]

Lovin it!!! Give me more - I can't get enough of this build up! This thing is going to be a screamer!!!

[Oneofthegreats]

Looking very tough!! Nice work fella's. Fast progress too!

Need's the MFP rear window sticker.

What rim's are those?

[Valver.]

My old car :)

[rayray086]

Very nice Matt!

[Golf Loon]

The wheels were the spares in Golf 4, 2Ls and GTIs. Chasing up 4 of them was fun!!

[static1800]

Looking good ;)

[rayray086]

Matt, by how much are the VR6 bits wider?

[DubSteve]

Very nice Matt love the work :)

[Golf Loon]

Matt, by how much are the VR6 bits wider?

About an inch each side.
You need VR6 wishbones, hubs, rack ends, driveshafts and antirollbar. You can keep the original subframe and steering rack, or swop the lot.

[evorobin]

You wouldn't run the std front swaybar surely? what rear bar you running?

[GermanwithaVdub]

antirollbar = swaybar

[Golf Loon]

Using STD VR6 front swaybar which is thicker than even the uprated cupra bar.

Standard Cupra roll bar at the moment, but we have H+R rear bar and front and rear strut braces if thats not enough.

Had a huuge tidy up at work today, so will probably modify the intercooler mount and have a trial fit of the front tomorrow.

[Valver.]

It had a $550 H&R front s/bar on it. Surely no twit removed that - it sharpened up the handling no end, despite all the misinformation that you're better off with no front swaybar on most VAG FWDs :)

It needed a 28mm rear item - a Neuspeed Mk2 Golf one is the way to go: they fit with minor mods to the end links.

Goodluck with the car. I still have a lot of parts for it here, which I removed prior to sale, if you're interested.

[Golf Loon]

We have the front swaybar here. It doesnt fit the VR6 front end.
Scrapped the shell this week, although I still have the front half.
You would have shed a tear seeing the rear half get crushed onto the top of a truck.

[Golf Loon]

Havent really had much time for this car recently, what with expanding the business and moving stuff to a bigger workshop. However, managed to snatch an hour on it today.

Plugged a few more wires in, hooked up the clutch pedal and shifter and SHE GOES!!!!!!

IT RUNS! WAHOOO

It cold starts and idles, but had no water in it, so we only ran it for a minute.

Now am gonna put the front back on and the dash in and then, lookout Sydney ;)

[Water Boy]

Sound good Matt... We need some more pics :D

[Oneofthegreats]

Nice work there Matt. Can't wait to see the finished pic's of this weapon.

Business must be booming. New premises. Alway's good to see a euro business going grey gun's & thriving.

[Soundofav6]

Great work Matt congras in the business side too.
I need to come down for my service soon before the 20vt zooms off :D

[rayray086]

Well done Matt. Hope Dave brings it to one of our GTGs some time in the future!

[Golf Loon]

Great work Matt congras in the business side too.
I need to come down for my service soon before the 20vt zooms off :D

Thanks Louis, we have a new hoist and full time mechanic now. Book in anytime you like.

[Golf Loon]

Well done Matt. Hope Dave brings it to one of our GTGs some time in the future!

He will, he has had enough of driving the ute!

[Golf Loon]

So its been a busy week, but I promised Dave we would do some work on his car this Saturday, so we hooked in and finished it!

It was looking sad and dusty with no front and no dash in the back of the workshop.

We had a crazy mission remaking the intercooler mounting and radiator support so that it does not protrude and can be hidden in true stealth style.

Then a bit of a nip and tuck to the back of the bumper.
SERIOUSLY, folks this is Hard, dont try it at home. It would have been much easier to have the intercooled hanging out ricer stylee.

Put the front back on, lights, grille and then plugged everything into the dash.

Went for a spin and whooooooooooooooo. Dave wasnt really giving it cos the car was cold and the brakes werent bled and then the oil buzzer went off!! Argh, went back to the workshop, oil switch is very inaccessable on an AUG 20V motor! Tried the set of clocks that came in the donor car on a hunch and all seemed well.

Then I went for a solo spin. WOW!! Most amusing moment was me thinking whats that screetching noize, oh its the tyres scrabbling for grip!

Heaps better than the gutless 16v, this thing is insane when it comes on boost.

140 in 3rd gear scared me a bit and I wasnt even trying really.

Took it back and Dave had a go, he came back grinning and gibbering too!
Fans work, no leaks, locked it back up and called it a night.

Monday it gets a wheel alignment, brake bleed and exhaust welding then lookout Sydders. I reckon Ibeezer will bring it to the cruize, see you there.

http://www.vwwatercooled.com.au/forums/images/imported/2007/10/Image002-1.jpg

[Golf Loon]

http://www.vwwatercooled.com.au/forums/images/imported/2007/10/Image000-1.jpg

http://www.vwwatercooled.com.au/forums/images/imported/2007/10/Image004-1.jpg

http://www.vwwatercooled.com.au/forums/images/imported/2007/10/Image006-1.jpg

[evorobin]

Good work Matt & Dave. Head Gasket has just gone on mine don't think it hasn't crossed my mind...

[h100vw]

Good work Matt & Dave. Head Gasket has just gone on mine don't think it hasn't crossed my mind...

I'll knock that idea out of you on holiday.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/stetsasonic A mate in the States built this monkey, 250-280 WHP, ABA 16v turbo on megasquirt.

Gavin

[static1800]

Should paint the intercooler black so the car has total stealth. Looks hot though!

[gpk_gti]

Then I went for a solo spin. WOW!! Most amusing moment was me thinking whats that screetching noize, oh its the tyres scrabbling for grip!

hehehehe,,:D,that sounds awesome!!! great build guys!!! cant wait to see it at the cruise!!!

ps- how much will ibeezer charge us for a ride(ala luna park style??) LOL:cool:

[Golf Loon]

You inspired this car George, after the last cruise when your beast just effortlessly catches up with anything.

You dont want the hot seat next to Ibeezer. I sat there briefly and its very scary.

[gpk_gti]

hahahahhahaaaj: ............. scary?? COOL!!! ok peeps! tickets on sale for your hot 5 min ride in the BEEEEEZAAAA from HELL !!! $6.66 ea!!:D:cool:

[GermanwithaVdub]

ill take one!

20vt or vr6, 20vt or vr6... the choices are killing me

[Valver.]

You would have shed a tear seeing the rear half get crushed onto the top of a truck.

LOL - why? They're hardly as rare as hens' teeth. The only good part from that car is still here and now making up half of my new engine :)

Conversion looks great :D Cupras are already half decent sleepers, but that is even better. It needs a bigger turbo, though!!

TassieGTI's Mk1 is great fun with a K03 but I can't imagine it setting the world on fire with another 400kg to tow around!

I have a Garrett GT28RS here, which I didn't end up using if he's interested :D j:

[Golf Loon]

They are pretty rare in Australia mate. I saw the figures and only 52 were delivered here in 99.

It is nice stock with reliability and predictable cold start which is harder to achieve with aftermarket management.

The QPENG stuff is the shizzle.

Its plenty fast enough for a daily and slightly more refined than a Mk1.
Needs the antiroll bar fitting to the back, I managed to spin it round on a testdrive!


Makes me motivated to put this other 20VT engine together and sling it in the rocco.

[gtimk5]

Congratulations Loon. Great write up too mate.
Be great to see this thing in the flesh.
Well done,
Andrew :)

[SoVeReIgN]

Very nice!

I especially love the chasers - Any idea what they're worth from VW spares? I wouldn't mind getting a pair and some slicks! :)

And where are you located in Camden Golfloon? I live near the crossroads, you're probably a 20minute trip from my place! :)

[SoVeReIgN]

ill take one!

20vt or vr6, 20vt or vr6... the choices are killing me

Anyone know what the 1.8t and mk3 VR6 weigh? (Just the engines I mean)

That'd be a huge factor in my decision if I was using one of them in a transplant!

[Golf Loon]

Thanks Guys

Sovereign, the problem with the chasers is that they only came as spares on Golf 4 GTIs and 2Ls. Most wreckers we spoke to had chucked heaps of em out.

I`m at Campbelltown mate 18/41 Badgally Rd, probably 15-20mins from you.

Having built a VR6 Beeza and now a 20VT I feel qualified to comment on both. The 20VT is more refined and feels like a grown up car. The VR6 always felt like a racecar with a numberplate.

The VR6 would be a cheaper conversion now, as you could plug an early loom straight into a G2, or SEAT fusebox, thus saving thousands in fuel management computer. The 20VT needs a more complex soloution.

The 20VT with a cableshift box is still a heavy lump of motor.

I`d like to get the two cars to Eastern Creek and see what they can do as a comparison test. I`ll have to talk to William, I reckon Dave will be willing.

Ibeezer took the car home yesterday, look out for it in the Mortdale - Botany area soon.

[static1800]

Sweet, will have to get dave to give me a ride next time im up ;)

[DubSteve]

Nice work Matt awesome to see this being done in oz :) Hope Dave comes out to the cruise next week will be sweet to see his ride.


I`d like to get the two cars to Eastern Creek and see what they can do as a comparison test. I`ll have to talk to William, I reckon Dave will be willing.


If going by the drive that I took in Williams beeza last time he had it on the road, I think it will be a awesome run!

[ibeezer]

Yep, defnatly be at the cruise, if im still alive!. Like Mat (the test pilot) mentioned, the handling needs work. In a straight line its fine but introduce it to the slightest bend an its a handfull. I'll fit the front strut bar and rear sway bar hopefuly that'll improve it. Not complaining about the powa tho. Well chuffed

[Oneofthegreats]

Hat's off to you guy's.

Excellent job. Set a plan & achieved it 100%.

I absolutely love stealthly car's & this one is right up my alley. My only suggestion would be to paint the intercooler black.

Get some more pic's up. I want to see more.

Great write up too Loon.

What's next??? 20VT Scirocco?

[Golf Loon]

Yeah a 20V rocco would be nice next. Theres always something in front of it tho.

Would a black intercooler cool as efficiently? what do you blokes reckon?

Took a few better pics the other day.

http://www.vwwatercooled.com.au/forums/images/imported/2007/11/100_1003-1.jpg

http://www.vwwatercooled.com.au/forums/images/imported/2007/11/100_1005-1.jpg

http://www.vwwatercooled.com.au/forums/images/imported/2007/11/100_1009-1.jpg

[Golf Loon]

http://www.vwwatercooled.com.au/forums/images/imported/2007/11/100_1008-1.jpg

http://www.vwwatercooled.com.au/forums/images/imported/2007/11/100_1007-1.jpg

[DaveMack]

What tyres are those, Loon?

Dave

[Golf Loon]

What tyres are those, Loon?

Dave

Falken 205/40/16

[GoLfMan]

Loon there is no reason why a black intercooler would not cool just as efficiently as a silver one, its the air flow through the intercooler that cools the air and i dont see black paint getting in the way of that!

[GermanwithaVdub]

Loon there is no reason why a black intercooler would not cool just as efficiently as a silver one, its the air flow through the intercooler that cools the air and i dont see black paint getting in the way of that!

hmmm but you wouldnt want to paint all the little blades, i think that would make it a chuck out. but paint the bits that dont do any cooling i guess.

[static1800]

You could get a nice few thin coats on and it wouldnt effect airflow i reckon. I think the car needs it, it has the whole sleeper look going on so may as well continue with the IC.

[gpk_gti]

id ditch the blue pipe which is more associated with a IC,maybe black tape wrap it? and if you paint the edge (solid silver piece)black then the center wont stand out as much.it will look more like a oil cooler or a radiator.......:D


STEALTH ROCKS......................:cool:

[DaveMack]

id ditch the blue pipe which is more associated with a IC,maybe black tape wrap it? and if you paint the edge (solid silver piece)black then the center wont stand out as much.it will look more like a oil cooler or a radiator.......:D


STEALTH ROCKS......................:cool:

Yeah ... what George said. :D

Dave

[ibeezer]

What tyres are those, Loon?

Dave


Falken 205/40/16

Goodyear dsg3s Dave

[DaveMack]

Goodyear dsg3s Dave

Cheers, Dave

Dave

[FarQ]

how much would a VR6 conversion cost roughly?

[Water Boy]

Man sleeper much... I love the pop out rear windows... Get the intercooler clack and make sure u keep the steelies on...

Now get some more go-fast goodies and really start blowing the doors of ricers...

Quick question do u have some sort of LSD in there for some twin spinning smoking action from the front wheels that would really freak em out :D

[Golf Loon]

Dave just let me have a good go in this car, some motorway driving. Its very civilized for a conversion. You can drive it sensibly, or like a Lunatic. I didnt have the radio on, engine was music enough. :D

[gldgti]

loon, the intercooler will work best in the raw.

FYI everyone - heat is transfered from the hot intake air to cooling air flowing from he outside through the aluminium make up of the intercooler. the wrong kind of paint may act as a heat transfer barrier, a bit like a ceramic coating or similar.

radiator paint will minimise any heat transfer changes. i dont know if you can buy it, or if its much different to normal enamel, but radiator shops nearly always paint repaired radiators in black glossy paint.

[ibeezer]

Thanks for all the comments guys, seems the stealth look was the way to go. I like it a lot, i think of any excuse to go to the garage just to perv at it. Blacked out intercooler would look good but the thought of taking the front off again..nah.

[Bora Sport]

I see this thread hasn't been added to for a while. As a Cupra owner I am very interested in this car. An update would be good if you have the time.

[Golf Loon]

He has moved to Canberra but the car is still driving around and has been Tuned recently and engineered.

Update Dave?

[aprr32]

Tuning the QPeng ecu is so stoneage compared even to Microtech. Even the guys at QP in England couldn't provide the tech help and they don't have a tech manual.The problem with overseas stuff is there is nearly no support.An Autronic SM4 would be the go.But in the end after 20to 25 hours of trying to figure out the backwards way they built the ecu we managed to get 93.6 KW's at the wheels from only 10 to11 psi from a 110KW at the fly engine.And it stops and turns very well,almost feels like a Golf 1 the way it handles!

[tommymac]

**** me dead matt - amazing your vr6 scared the **** out of me so this must be quick! seriously thought i was going to die in the biza! wow stunning work matt another quality conversion!

[Langers]

Loon there is no reason why a black intercooler would not cool just as efficiently as a silver one, its the air flow through the intercooler that cools the air and i dont see black paint getting in the way of that!

Don't be silly. Of course it would. Any sort of coating, whether paint or anodisation, will reduce heat transfer capability.

[Valver.]

Don't be silly. Of course it would. Any sort of coating, whether paint or anodisation, will reduce heat transfer capability.

Not enough to worry at this level of tune.

[GoLfMan]

Don't be silly. Of course it would. Any sort of coating, whether paint or anodisation, will reduce heat transfer capability.

the loss would be minor in any case :rolleyes:

[Valver.]

the loss would be minor in any case :rolleyes:

You're right :) The turbo is far too small to generate the heat required for a more efficient intercooler... Hence why the standard side mount is spec'ed and works fine for most applications (and it's still less efficient than a front mount with a lick of paint!).

[DVR68U]

yeah ive always heard that paint will make very little difference to heat transfer. i used to hear about it all the time will beetle motors with ppl painting or not painting their barrels on the motors, atleast when you paint steel or alloy it wont corrode. also a polished surface vs a ruff surface etc etc. ive even seen studys and it was very little difference. i would think other benifits would well out weight the heat transfer anyway, like not letting the cops have a reason to pull you over lol. nothing like a big shiny intercooler to get a cops attention. then youll have to pop the bonnet, and being the mech's they are im sure they can find something illegal lol
if i was dave i would paint it black in a sec.
cheers brenton

[Golf Loon]

Bit of an update, Dave has been through about 4 sets of wheels, here is the latest.
What do you lot reckon??

http://www.vwwatercooled.com.au/forums/images/imported/2009/10/SDC12429-1.jpg

[Bboy_Sparx]

Yep I like that

[Mrk_Mickey]

Yeah they're nice :) the car has the same sort of shape as a polo because it's compact and round-ish so it works nicely! :)

[jayjay]

hahaha. it's a fair sight faster than a polo gti too... :)

come to think of it, it's like a 20vt polo gti minus 100kg stock.

thank you dave, these wheels are a lot better than the early style mk4 gti wheels. :)

[Golf Loon]

thank you dave, these wheels are a lot better than the early style mk4 gti wheels. :)

Yeah he only bought em for the tyres, I have been trying to persuade him to keep the polo ones and not just put the tyres on his gti wheels.

The offset is awesone with the pogo wheels.

[Golf Houso]

Great looking wheels, a wash would also help as well haha!

[Cupra]

good to see Dave is maintaining his high standard of cleanliness...:rolleyes: & I think the wheels suit it as well

[Golf Loon]

Bump this thread as a couple of similar conversions brewing at the moment.
This car gave 2 years total reliability, went to the track a few times, 1.16 round Wakefield, ended up with Autronic replacing the QPEng and made 113kw at the wheels last time it was on the dyno.
Sadly got T boned by a clown in a new Golf 6, so all the good bits are destined for a MK3.

[Bora Sport]

Quite amazing as I recall the donor car was T boned at a round a bout just before I went to look at it.

[Golf Loon]

Quite amazing as I recall the donor car was T boned at a round a bout just before I went to look at it.

I know, ridiculous. Maybe the engine is cursed.

Hopefully not, as the whole lot is now in a Mk3, ready very soon.

[MeeM]

Can't wait to see the Mk3. The Ibiza was a real sleeper and it's a pity we didn't see more of it.

Sent from my HTC Desire using Tapatalk

[Cupra]

Sad to hear another beezer has gone to god.