Diesel Particulate Filter

[MidnightDog]

Hey guys,

Pretty new here. I'm currently trying to figure out whether there might be any alternative to replacing the DPF in my 2008 Golf GT TDI 170 and would like some advice.

Warning lamps came up on the dash a couple of days ago at 88 000ish and the engine lost almost all its power, particularly above 1st gear and in higher ranges. I wasn't driving it at the time. Specifically, the DPF lamp, the spiral "engine fault" lamp and the other square one with bits coming off it that I can't remember the name of right now. I called into a VW-specialised (but not dealership) mechanic here in Canberra and he told me to try the regeneration trick. I ran it at 1750rpm steady for 20km in 5th gear, then tried the same revs in 6th on the way back.

The mechanic had said that if this didn't work (it didn't) it'd need to go in to the dealership due to their superior diagnostics and, if the DPF was the problem, have it replaced for ~$500 + labour. Problem is, the only two Canberra dealerships seem to be fully booked for f***ing weeks.

I've read a lot of hatred for the DPF. Now that my warranty has expired, at some stage in the future I wouldn't mind some minor tuning (maybe just a remap), and I hear the DPF can cause problems with that.

So, my questions:

- If I keep driving it in its current state while I wait for the dealership to service it, do I risk doing more damage? It has roughly the acceleration of a metro bus, but it still takes me from A to B. Where I live, being carless is a serious problem.
- Are there any alternatives to replacing the DPF that won't cause more issues in the future? I've read a bit about "DPF deletion" but haven't found anything conclusive.
- Is this a common occurrence with this car? It's been a good car but has had its share of problems, to be honest (intermittent power loss a while back, complete injector failure, headlight problems, this).
- Any misc advice?

Thank you!

MD

[Tuning Dynamics]

What youa re experiencing is sadly pretty common.
You will have a high DPF blockage percentage. Your only options is a forced regeneration either by the dealer or by a shop with VAGCOM.
Vagcom is able to force a regen. From experience the issue will come back and it seems once they get to this blockage point the regen will last from a couple of days to a few months.
Currently the car is dumping fuel and in limp mode to protect it from further issues. Not the best to keep driving too much im afraid.
By law youa re unable to remove the DPF as its part of the emmissions system.
They are likely to be a few grand to replace.
A decent ecu tune will actually run cleaner and allow the dpf a happier life but you need to get the regen numbers into the green so its out of limp mode. The longer you drive it the more clogged it will get so be aware of that.
Feel free to PM me for more info and we are in Canberra next week which may be of help to you.

[h100vw]

The DPF is a fair but more than $500. That might cover the labour for fitting a new one.

You need to have it diagnosed properly first and make sure it's not a sensor lying to the ECU. It would be unusual in my experience for an out of town car to have a blocked DPF at 88000ks. I have seen one dead at 105000k and a country car with 150000ks that was well less than 50% full.

There's VW independents in Canberra, give them a go before the dealer.

Gavin

[gecko2k]

Give Transporter a call. I believe he is based in Canberra....

[h100vw]

Give Transporter a call. I believe he is based in Canberra....

Miro is in Adelaide. :( There's a couple of others there though.

Gavin

[Umai Naa!!]

Is it not simply just the DPF pressure differential sensor? If that's gone, you can't do a regeneration on it. The part's not that dear, either.

Last I checked, DPFs for passenger cars were around $2,500. Warranty wont cover them unless they've failed as a result of a related faulty component.

FWIW, I've replaced one at 2,000klms as the customer only used the car on two 5 minute trips every couple of days.

Have you tried Canberra VW Centre?

[MidnightDog]

Damn. This got depressing pretty quick. Thank you for all your responses, guys. Very helpful.

Umai, I did take it into the VW Centre in Belconnen - he's the one that said I needed to take it to the dealership. I guess he was wrong about the cost of a new DPF. He was also booked out for 6 weeks. Similar time for the VW Centre in Tuggeranong. Lennock VW (dealership) is booked for a month. There's one more option that I'll explore. Failing that, I'm not sure what I can do but wait :/

I'll try not to drive it at all if it's going to do more damage. I guess I'll have to hope it's the ECU, as you guys mentioned.

ATPG - I'll send you a PM.

[h100vw]

I'll go out on a limb and promise it's not the ECU. VW Centre should have been able to force a regen. VCDS is as capable as the dealer tool in this instance, unless they didn't have time.

If the DPF is full you can't make it worse. Without a proper diagnosis though there's a risk of doing it harm if it isn't.


EDIT: http://www.vwwatercooled.org.au/forums/f20/vag-com-scanning-who-can-help-27504.html

Have a look here and see if there's someone in Canberra that can help you out. If there's no one there, send me a PM and I might have another avenue I can try, this will involve you having a windows laptop though.

Gavin




Damn. This got depressing pretty quick. Thank you for all your responses, guys. Very helpful.

Umai, I did take it into the VW Centre in Belconnen - he's the one that said I needed to take it to the dealership. I guess he was wrong about the cost of a new DPF. He was also booked out for 6 weeks. Similar time for the VW Centre in Tuggeranong. Lennock VW (dealership) is booked for a month. There's one more option that I'll explore. Failing that, I'm not sure what I can do but wait :/

I'll try not to drive it at all if it's going to do more damage. I guess I'll have to hope it's the ECU, as you guys mentioned.

ATPG - I'll send you a PM.

[MidnightDog]

Gavin,

I'm having a chat with ATPG at the moment about possibly seeing those guys in Canberra next week, so if that works out it should be a good solution. If I need to I might have a look through that thread too. At worst, I'd even consider running the car up to Sydney if I thought it was going to save me a few weeks of being totally carless.

I don't have a Windows laptop, I'm a Mac fanboy :( But I could probably get it going via BootCamp if necessary. If I can't get anything sorted I'll send you a PM :)

Thanks mate,

MD

[h100vw]

Mac huh! ;0) some way from taking over the world.! Let me know if you need any help. Gavin

[Umai Naa!!]

I'm not sure with VCDS, but with VAS-PC (The official software), you can't perform a regeneration on the DPF if it's over 90% clogged. Depending on the vehicle, and software version, the regeneration may be required to be carried out on the run (out on the open road).

[duderduderini]

Rußpartikelfilter Partikelfilter DPF Audi A3 VW Golf V Skoda Octavia Seat Altea | eBay (http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Ruspartikelfilter-Partikelfilter-DPF-Audi-A3-VW-Golf-V-Skoda-Octavia-Seat-Altea-/170827720176?pt=DE_Autoteile&hash=item27c62025f0)
Dont know if this helps but it seems a lot cheaper os than here
Good luck

[h100vw]

That's nothing like the standard Dpf. So I don't think it would do the job.


Rußpartikelfilter Partikelfilter DPF Audi A3 VW Golf V Skoda Octavia Seat Altea | eBay (http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Ruspartikelfilter-Partikelfilter-DPF-Audi-A3-VW-Golf-V-Skoda-Octavia-Seat-Altea-/170827720176?pt=DE_Autoteile&hash=item27c62025f0)
Dont know if this helps but it seems a lot cheaper os than here
Good luck

[Gigitt]

Rußpartikelfilter Partikelfilter DPF Audi A3 VW Golf V Skoda Octavia Seat Altea | eBay (http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Ruspartikelfilter-Partikelfilter-DPF-Audi-A3-VW-Golf-V-Skoda-Octavia-Seat-Altea-/170827720176?pt=DE_Autoteile&hash=item27c62025f0)
Dont know if this helps but it seems a lot cheaper os than here
Good luck

wrong type

probably more like :
VW Touran GP2 2,0L TDI 170PS Kat DPF Dieselpartikelfilter 1K0131723P | eBay (http://www.ebay.de/itm/VW-Touran-GP2-2-0L-TDI-170PS-Kat-DPF-Dieselpartikelfilter-1K0131723P-/251037414289?pt=DE_Autoteile&hash=item3a72fef391)

or

eBay: Neue und gebrauchte Elektronikartikel, Autos, Kleidung, Sammlerst (http://www.ebay.de/itm/VW-Golf-Auspuff-Katalysator-Kat-DPF-Partikelfilter-Dieselpartikelfilter-3715-/130640575515?pt=DE_Autoteile&hash=item1e6ac8fc1b)

---------- Post added at 09:46 PM ---------- Previous post was at 09:33 PM ----------

Better still:

http://kat-company.com/?sl=EN
DPF Cleaning Service

[MidnightDog]

If I can get a part number I'll definitely explore the ebay route rather than paying dealership prices...

[h100vw]

Pm me your email, chassis number and engine code, I'll look it up for you.
Gavin

[Zak]

I've just had the DPF light come on with my 2010 Tiguan with 50k on the clock. I've taken it for a run down the freeway at ~2500rpm to try and clear it (read that in a UK VW forum) but to no avail.

I'm a bit pissed as I love my Volksies and did my research with respect to the diesel over the petrol, but this problem didn't show up for me.

Being a n00b with this plugging in computer to cars stuff I'm not sure where I'm at.... but am I correct in thinking that a regen is effectively a temporary fix? Do we pay the ~$500 to get a few months of joy only to be stung with ~$3000 for a replacement DPF later down the track? Do we regen and just sell the thing? The DPF seems to be such a crock!?

Cheers!

[Umai Naa!!]

Could be something simple like a DPF pressure differential sensor. Having said that, any DPF-related faults need to be diagnosed and repaired ASAP. Prolonged driving with a DPF-related fault present, may damage the DPF.

[Tuning Dynamics]

I've just had the DPF light come on with my 2010 Tiguan with 50k on the clock. I've taken it for a run down the freeway at ~2500rpm to try and clear it (read that in a UK VW forum) but to no avail.

I'm a bit pissed as I love my Volksies and did my research with respect to the diesel over the petrol, but this problem didn't show up for me.

Being a n00b with this plugging in computer to cars stuff I'm not sure where I'm at.... but am I correct in thinking that a regen is effectively a temporary fix? Do we pay the ~$500 to get a few months of joy only to be stung with ~$3000 for a replacement DPF later down the track? Do we regen and just sell the thing? The DPF seems to be such a crock!?

Cheers!

hi,
Definately get the dealership to check the pressure sensors. They have a history of failure in aus, but make sure if it is and they replace it that you argue to have the dpf replaced as its the most common form of dpf failure , ie caused by pressure sensor failures. Even if its able to be regen'd now, make it noted on the service records about the sensor in case you have further issues.

[Greg Roles]

First up, if you ever need to replace a DPF, definately look at ebay UK and europe, I have seen MKV GT TDI ones for $700. You could have the long tailpipe removed to drop shipping costs, you just want the cannister and can weld on your old tailpipe.

I will have replacement cores available before too long, both standard and high flow, allowing a potentially legal "DPF delete" tune ( where you turn the regen operation off but it still removes most of the soot passively ). Removing the DPF entirely is a HUGE fine if caught, especially for tuners, so I won't do it I'm afraid.

That said, if there was no option, then Custom Code still have the only proven delete tune period. I don't care what anyone else claims, even the brand I represent. Only custom code have spent the time to work it out properly, everyone else is using a third party buy in, and I've yet to see one that works properly long term, and I know diesels.

As pointed out, the differential pressure sensor is notorious for playing up, and there is a revised part now, mine played up and I put the new sensor on, being a new part number. VW sells truckloads of them apparently.

The DPF is doing automatic regens when it reaches 40% blockage. You are usually unaware of this apart from the car idling at 1000rpm at times, and it feels a bit "rougher" to drive as boost presures are more aggressive to counter the mostly closed inlet flap during regen.

If the car fails to regen at 40% for whatever reason, usually a number of short trips beyond this point, it continues to fill up till it hits 60% at which point it will put up a warning on the dash "follow instructions" flash the coil light, and show the dpf symbol as it forces a regen. I've taken my car to this point many a time during experimentation, and it easily gets back down to "zero". So at this stage the DPF is a long way from cactus.

If this level fails, and for whatever reason it reaches 80%, the car goes into limp, and you HAVE to visit the dealer for a idle / forced regen, it is dangerous to try a Vag Com induced regen on the car as it *may* catch fire given the blockage and massive regen temps and time. Unlikely though.

As Gav has pointed out, it is unlikely for a DPF to go before 100k, more likely to reach 150k, but if the dealer cannot regen it, and it reaches a certain gram weight of soot ( 40g off the top of my head ) then it is indeed dead, and you need a new core.

Largely the DPF works well, and keeping the car on boost, running a Provent to reduce oil ash, and making sure your car gets some 80kph plus drives for a good 10 mins or so here and there all aid it's lifespan.

I am very aware some people choose to delete it, thing is the car becomes a horrible soot blower, and even the young bucks that have done it are now talking to me about the possible "high flow never clog no regen" DPF core, as that much soot is simply embarassing these days. Once I can prove it works on my car, I will look into the legality of having it produced, and go from there. It's a big task, but one that I believe to be possible. It won't happen in the short term though!!!

[jazd]

That said, if there was no option, then Custom Code still have the only proven delete tune period. I don't care what anyone else claims, even the brand I represent. Only custom code have spent the time to work it out properly, everyone else is using a third party buy in, and I've yet to see one that works properly long term, and I know diesels.

Are you sure this is still the case Greg? I think there are more companies who are capable of doing it now eg. Shark. It is something that I am looking at doing myself at the moment. I have discovered that a lot of companies try to use a program called "ECU Safe" which supposedly automatically removes the DPF functionality from the ECU file (I think this is the buy in you are referring to). In the case of the Siemens PPD ECUs this seems to not work very well. If you read the ECU safe blog (http://www.ecusafe.com/html/news.html) they explain that in an updated version of their software they work around the problem by changing the limp mode torque limiters... No thanks :D

edit. Was just reading some forums tonight and it seems that Shark also "remove" the limp mode.. Maybe CC does this too?

[Greg Roles]

Feel free to be a test bunny, but if DMS and other HUGE comapnies fail long term, well I know who I would be sticking with. Yes I have heard of Shark, but so too who has run their tune for 20,000kms? Plenty of UK tuners offer it, but from all I have read the regen seems to eventually find a way to turn back on.......and that's a disaster!

[MidnightDog]

Feel like I should post a resolution to this thread - ATPG managed to regen my DPF today when I took it into them. It was brutally clogged - 260-something percent above threshold - but they got it down to about 14% or less on the road. Who knows whether it'll happen again, but I'll try to avoid getting a whole new part until it seems absolutely necessary. They also remapped the car - take a look at the tuning section if you want to hear the results of that...

Thanks for everyone's input; I hope Zak's DPF problem gets resolved successfully.

[davidno64]

Hi,

have read your problem. I have had simlar problems and all at a bad time of
seeking ongoing surgery. In fact thats why I bought this car was for my medical
condition and the car allegid reliability.

Anyway Simlar problems and mine started with the fues tank pump. The one
submerged in the diesel. I have a thread on this under Diesels and DPF smoking.
I am at the point of considering legal action against VW. and if so a more the
merryer (power in n umbers). Read my post, see what you think and if your
interested in getting together for fact. Then it minght be worth taking this further.

[MidnightDog]

Bump...

Sigh. I think my DPF has decided that it is, in fact, going to clog up again. Yesterday the particulate light flashed on just for a moment and then disappeared. However, I'm quite sure I can also feel a slight power loss.

No fault of ATPG, obviously - this DPF just seems to be beyond regeneration, unless it's a sensor fault. I'm taking the car to Sydney on Thursday to have it diagnosed once and for all, since everywhere in Canberra is booked out until hell freezes over. I've decided to take it before it goes into super-clogged limp mode and makes the trip impossible.

I wanted to ask people's opinion about DPF replacement. Obviously it's illegal to remove the DPF so I won't do that. However, the Sydney mechanic has given me a rough estimate of $2000-2500 to replace it, IF it ends up being the DPF and not a sensor. This has got me to thinking that since this part's apparently a piece of crap anyway, AND results in substantial power and economy losses, what about an aftermarket one? Does anyone have any experience of aftermarket DPFs? I've heard Milltek makes something but from what I can see (Volkswagen Golf Mk5 GT 2.0 TDI 170PS DPF Milltek exhaust (http://www.millteksport.com/exhaust.products.cfm?variantid=264)) it's just a downpipe, not an actual filter. Also HJS Motorsport.

I haven't priced any yet - maybe they're even more expensive than VW's part. I know the stock DPF on this engine takes a significant toll in performance and economy so if an aftermarket one resulted in a big improvement I'd consider it well worth the effort, especially since it would leave more leeway for power gains if I later decided to put on a bigger turbo or something insane like that.

Any input would be much appreciated.

[jazd]

Miltek don't make a replacement DPF they make a straight through down pipe for doing a DPF delete. Don't think anyone supplies aftermarket DPFs, Greg is working on one as he mentioned but not yet.

My advice, go to your dealership and buy a new G450 sensor. It is under $100 and you can install it yourself. Then drive around at 2500rpm 5th gear or something. Don't know where you got 1750rpm from but that is too low, I'd be wanting AT LEAST 2000rpm. You should be able to see the soot loading drop steadily if you hook up a laptop running VCDS. Hunt someone down in Canberra who has one. You also need VCDS to adapt the ECU to the new sensor.

Have a look at these two threads for more info:
http://www.vwwatercooled.org.au/forums/f28/help-exhaust-pressure-sensor-1-g450-signal-too-high-62596.html
http://www.vwwatercooled.org.au/forums/f153/vcds-label-file-gt-tdi-engine-bmn-125kw-170ps-62631.html#post714242

[Greg Roles]

Get a Vag Com cable. You can then diagnose it yourself, and can force a regen at will, when it suits.

You can indeed get a DPF from europe under a grand, and fitting is something any half decent Mechanic can do. Still a quote around the $2k mark is pretty good compared to the $4k plus VW wanted for a replacement DPF when they first came out.....

I have yet to prove my idea of a high flow one will work, but I hope to have drop in standard cores for all the dpf cars in the next few months....not in time to help you though!!

[Diesel_vert]

You can indeed get a DPF from europe under a grand, and fitting is something any half decent Mechanic can do. Still a quote around the $2k mark is pretty good compared to the $4k plus VW wanted for a replacement DPF when they first came out.....

Price hasn't dropped much, it's still around $3700 here just for the part itself. :o

[MidnightDog]

Thanks for the suggestions, guys. I'll probably get a cable at some point, but right now I don't even have a Windows laptop to run the software. I figure there's really not much point trying to regenerate with this DPF since if it starts to clog up again within a week (assuming it's not a sensor - which I shall find out) it's probably pretty f'ed. I don't want to have to burn it off manually once every 3 days to stay at maximum power. As for the 1750 rev figure, that was what I was told to try first by a VW specialist in Canberra.

I guess I'll just have to cop the price of a new one if it turns out not to be the sensor - and I don't see any DPFs for this model on eBay. Apparently there's quite a bit of 'precious metal' in DPFs, hence the expense.

Right now the clogging is rapidly sucking all the power out of my lovely new tune. Can't wait to have this dealt with so I can go and lose my license (like a boss).

MD

[jazd]

There are definitely some on there -
VW GOLF A3 2.0TDI EXHAUST CATALYST DPF - 1K0 254 703 GX | eBay (http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/VW-GOLF-A3-2-0TDI-EXHAUST-CATALYST-DPF-1K0-254-703-GX-/190519632949?pt=UK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM&hash=item2c5bdae435)
VW GOLF DPF DIESEL PARTICULATE FILTER 2.0 TDI 2005-2008 BMN ENGINE DPF & CAT | eBay (http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/VW-GOLF-DPF-DIESEL-PARTICULATE-FILTER-2-0-TDI-2005-2008-BMN-ENGINE-DPF-CAT-/110761993942?pt=UK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM&hash=item19c9ede6d6)
Volkswagen VW Golf 2.0 Diesel Particulate Filter DPF2004-on** VWF146* BMN 170bhp | eBay (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Volkswagen-VW-Golf-2-0-Diesel-Particulate-Filter-DPF2004-on-VWF146-BMN-170bhp-/200748321581?pt=UK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM&hash=item2ebd884b2d)
VW GOLF 2.0 (BMN) 02/04 ON DIESEL PARTICULATE FILTER DPF | eBay (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/VW-GOLF-2-0-BMN-02-04-DIESEL-PARTICULATE-FILTER-DPF-/130624199581?pt=UK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM&hash=item1e69cf1b9d)
http://www.ebay.de/itm/Ruspartikelfilter-Partikelfilter-Skoda-Octavia-1Z-/170613927209?pt=DE_Autoteile&hash=item27b961ed29

Dont think first one is right but it says BMN Golf.

[MidnightDog]

There are definitely some on there -
VW GOLF A3 2.0TDI EXHAUST CATALYST DPF - 1K0 254 703 GX | eBay (http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/VW-GOLF-A3-2-0TDI-EXHAUST-CATALYST-DPF-1K0-254-703-GX-/190519632949?pt=UK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM&hash=item2c5bdae435)
VW GOLF DPF DIESEL PARTICULATE FILTER 2.0 TDI 2005-2008 BMN ENGINE DPF & CAT | eBay (http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/VW-GOLF-DPF-DIESEL-PARTICULATE-FILTER-2-0-TDI-2005-2008-BMN-ENGINE-DPF-CAT-/110761993942?pt=UK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM&hash=item19c9ede6d6)
Volkswagen VW Golf 2.0 Diesel Particulate Filter DPF2004-on** VWF146* BMN 170bhp | eBay (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Volkswagen-VW-Golf-2-0-Diesel-Particulate-Filter-DPF2004-on-VWF146-BMN-170bhp-/200748321581?pt=UK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM&hash=item2ebd884b2d)
VW GOLF 2.0 (BMN) 02/04 ON DIESEL PARTICULATE FILTER DPF | eBay (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/VW-GOLF-2-0-BMN-02-04-DIESEL-PARTICULATE-FILTER-DPF-/130624199581?pt=UK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM&hash=item1e69cf1b9d)
Rußpartikelfilter Partikelfilter Skoda Octavia 1Z | eBay (http://www.ebay.de/itm/Ruspartikelfilter-Partikelfilter-Skoda-Octavia-1Z-/170613927209?pt=DE_Autoteile&hash=item27b961ed29)

Dont think first one is right but it says BMN Golf.

Well, that's embarrassing. I didn't know my eBay skills were so poor.

Thanks Jazd - I'll probably try to order one myself rather than pay VW prices, since they are available. Much appreciated :)

[jazd]

Well, that's embarrassing. I didn't know my eBay skills were so poor.

Haha the trick is selecting "world-wide", search descriptions and also search ebay.de and ebay.co.uk as some sellers dont list as posting to Australia but will if you message them and ask.

Also helps to search for the part number with and without spaces!

[Diesel_vert]

Check this out - http://homepage.ntlworld.com/h5djr/elsawin/exhaust+dpf.pdf

According to that PDF file, it would appear that the correct part number for your 2.0 125 kW (engine code BMN) is 1K0254703FX.

But whatever the differences between the LHD, RHD, FWD & Quattro versions, I'm guessing the actual particulate filter would be identical??

[Gigitt]

Diesel_vert... You dont happen to have a 'file' containing a Jetta 125TDI 'CEG' engine code for a DPF part number?

[Diesel_vert]

Diesel_vert... You dont happen to have a 'file' containing a Jetta 125TDI 'CEG' engine code for a DPF part number?

I think you mean CEGA. Part number is 1K0254703PX. I have no idea what the differences are though.

I've found this site (http://vagcats.info/base/se/3/21/498/2/7472) but it doesn't really add any new light into it.

[Gigitt]

I think you mean CEGA. Part number is 1K0254703PX. I have no idea what the differences are though.

I've found this site (Êàòàëîã àâòîçàï÷àñòåé VAG (http://vagcats.info/base/se/3/21/498/2/7472)) but it doesn't really add any new light into it.

Nope My Engine code is CEG as per the Build Sticker in my Service Schedule, and Also the sticker on the Timing belt cover.

[Diesel_vert]

Nope My Engine code is CEG as per the Build Sticker in my Service Schedule, and Also the sticker on the Timing belt cover.

Well, either way, there is only one engine with an engine code that starts with the letters CEG.

Anyway, found the relevant info for your car (Êàòàëîã àâòîçàï÷àñòåé VAG (http://vagcats.info/base/vw/3/2038/604/2/6204)). It looks like the CEGA engine as fitted in a 2011 Jetta only uses the part number 1K0254703PX.

[Gigitt]

I think you mean CEGA. Part number is 1K0254703PX. I have no idea what the differences are though.

I've found this site (Êàòàëîã àâòîçàï÷àñòåé VAG (http://vagcats.info/base/se/3/21/498/2/7472)) but it doesn't really add any new light into it.

Looking at that very informative site...
found that the part number under 2010 Jetta CEGA is 1K0254703PX (RHD) 85,814.47 RUB = 2,814.58 AUD
(same part number under 2011 Jetta 1k)

---------- Post added at 07:15 PM ---------- Previous post was at 07:11 PM ----------


Well, either way, there is only one engine with an engine code that starts with the letters CEG.

Anyway, found the relevant info for your car (Êàòàëîã àâòîçàï÷àñòåé VAG (http://vagcats.info/base/vw/3/2038/604/2/6204)). It looks like the CEGA engine as fitted in a 2011 Jetta only uses the part number 1K0254703PX.

Yep found that,
thanks.

[MidnightDog]

FFFFFFFFFUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU-


2-day trip to Sydney was heartbreakingly pointless. VW/Audi specialist shop and they couldn't find anything wrong. I found it impossible to convince the mechanic that the car wasn't driving beautifully despite the fact that it judders slightly from time to time in certain rev ranges at low speeds. He seemed to think that's just a characteristic of diesels.

The car's now lost all the power that the tune gave it so it drives pretty much like stock, but of course he hadn't driven it after the tune so I couldn't seem to convince him that it had in fact lost power. The economy is also back to near-stock - getting about 5.8L/100 at 110.

Software obviously doesn't change once it's installed, so the gradual power loss over the 10 days since the car was tuned has to be exhaust-related, right? Mechanic also refused to do a forced regen as he said it was bad for the car to do it too often and it had been done very recently.

Their software showed the DPF soot load within the normal threshold. It also showed no fault codes whatsoever for the G450 sensor. But perhaps that in itself doesn't mean it's not broken - does anyone know if the G450 sensor even has fault codes or just relies on the DPF warning lamp? I know you've messed around with this sensor, Jazd - do you think it could be responsible for gradual loss of power even if the DPF itself is working fine? The symptoms the car's displaying just don't make sense to me.

I guess I'll just try to get the sensor replaced and hope that fixes the problem. I really am about ready to aim this car at a cliff and give it a big push. I could make it look like an accident...

[h100vw]

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2-day trip to Sydney was heartbreakingly pointless. VW/Audi specialist shop and they couldn't find anything wrong. I found it impossible to convince the mechanic that the car wasn't driving beautifully despite the fact that it judders slightly from time to time in certain rev ranges at low speeds. He seemed to think that's just a characteristic of diesels.

The car's now lost all the power that the tune gave it so it drives pretty much like stock, but of course he hadn't driven it after the tune so I couldn't seem to convince him that it had in fact lost power. The economy is also back to near-stock - getting about 5.8L/100 at 110.

Software obviously doesn't change once it's installed, so the gradual power loss over the 10 days since the car was tuned has to be exhaust-related, right? Mechanic also refused to do a forced regen as he said it was bad for the car to do it too often and it had been done very recently.

Their software showed the DPF soot load within the normal threshold. It also showed no fault codes whatsoever for the G450 sensor. But perhaps that in itself doesn't mean it's not broken - does anyone know if the G450 sensor even has fault codes or just relies on the DPF warning lamp? I know you've messed around with this sensor, Jazd - do you think it could be responsible for gradual loss of power even if the DPF itself is working fine? The symptoms the car's displaying just don't make sense to me.

I guess I'll just try to get the sensor replaced and hope that fixes the problem. I really am about ready to aim this car at a cliff and give it a big push. I could make it look like an accident...

With the sensor, the ECU has to recognise that the output is wrong in some way. It might be open circuit inside and providing no output at all, shorted always giving a high output or maybe a fixed output that isn't changing. Those are just examples.

http://www.vwwatercooled.org.au/forums/f28/help-exhaust-pressure-sensor-1-g450-signal-too-high-62596.html

Google G450 sensor and have a read.

Very difficult to diagnose over the internet. Don't envy your position but don't think it's time to park on a hill with the handbrake off yet.

Gavin

[jazd]

As Gavin said, there are errors for "signal too high", "short to ground" and "intermittant". It would be a bit odd if your sensor was playing up without one of those errors showing up. Still for the sake of $70 or what it is I'd replace it and see what happens. Be sure to do the adaptation in VCDS afterwards.

Also check out the stored values in VCDS for soot and ash loading, there are a few more too. Also check the values coming from the temperature sensors seem OK, there are three on the DPF.

Personally I'd remove the DPF as its more trouble than its worth, and I would say that because I removed mine myself today.

[MidnightDog]

As Gavin said, there are errors for "signal too high", "short to ground" and "intermittant". It would be a bit odd if your sensor was playing up without one of those errors showing up. Still for the sake of $70 or what it is I'd replace it and see what happens. Be sure to do the adaptation in VCDS afterwards.

Also check out the stored values in VCDS for soot and ash loading, there are a few more too. Also check the values coming from the temperature sensors seem OK, there are three on the DPF.

Personally I'd remove the DPF as its more trouble than its worth, and I would say that because I removed mine myself today.


I don't have VCDS, a cable or a Windows laptop right now, so I'll see what I can do to find someone who does.

You're a brave man :P I'd like nothing more than to rip the DPF out and toss it into a skip - I really would. However, I'd feel bad about the pollution coming from an unfiltered diesel, and I'd also worry about getting picked up for it. Google seems to indicate the fine is somewhere over $10 000. There's no yearly pink slip inspection here in the ACT, but there is in NSW - how do you plan to get around that?

P.S. What effect has the delete had? :D I can live vicariously...

[bluey]

Just wondering - if the DPF core has a big hole through it and is otherwise connected up, will the engine computer be happy? Use a cetane improver to reduce the smoke.

Been reading that ash can be reverse flushed out of a DPF, using water or hot water or pressure washer. Apparently Peugeot owners have been doing it for years. See for example http://www.honestjohn.co.uk/forum/post/index.htm?t=91801 http://www.peugeotforums.com/forums/engine-53/dpf-removal-clean-guide-18052/. Only hassle appears that the engine or subframe might have to be dropped to get the DPF out for a VAG TDI.

This article http://www.forddoctorsdts.com/articles/article-07-03.php says "The ash can only be removed by physical means such as washing, pulsed or swirled compressed air."

[The_Hawk]

Google seems to indicate the fine is somewhere over $10 000. There's no yearly pink slip inspection here in the ACT, but there is in NSW - how do you plan to get around that?

In NSW I believe it's this part you are looking for:

NSW Legislation (http://www.legislation.nsw.gov.au/viewtop/inforce/subordleg+428+2010+pt.4-div.4-sec.23+0+N/?autoquery=(Content%3D((%22penalty%22)))&display=Protection%20of%20the%20Environment%20Oper ations%20(Clean%20Air)%20Regulation%202010&dq=Within%20Title%3D%22Protection%20of%20the%20Env ironment%20Operations%20(Clean%20Air)%20Regulation %202010%22,%20Exact%20Phrase%3D%22penalty%22&fullquery=(Content%3D((%22penalty%22)))&withintitle=yes)

In short, unless it makes things more efficient (in relation to emissions) you are not allowed to remove or change things or you cop a fine if caught.

Getting caught on the other hand is a whole different story. The pink slip tests do not currently include an emissions test so unless it's belching a pile of black smoke and the testing agent thinks it's "too much" it's unlikely to be questioned. Ditto for most other enforcement bodies... it is diesel after all... That said, things are changing and more and more diesel cars emit less and less smoke making the likely hood of standing out more of a threat.

I would be very interested in seeing what the output difference actually is and where it would put the vehicle on the emissions scale with and without the DPF/Tune to see exactly how much difference it really makes.

Bottom line, it's not legal and the fines are pretty big for screwing with the EPA :(

[jazd]

I'd feel bad about the pollution coming from an unfiltered diesel, and I'd also worry about getting picked up for it. Google seems to indicate the fine is somewhere over $10 000. There's no yearly pink slip inspection here in the ACT, but there is in NSW - how do you plan to get around that?

P.S. What effect has the delete had? :D I can live vicariously...

The smoke isn't bad at all, remember its still a modern diesel and runs quite clean. Also every other Mk5 doesn't have one either.

There is only a visual inspection and they wouldn't know what they were looking at anyway, its not replaced by a down pipe, I hollowed it out and welded it back up.

Revs much more freely at higher rpm now, thats the main difference.


Just wondering - if the DPF core has a big hole through it and is otherwise connected up, will the engine computer be happy? Use a cetane improver to reduce the smoke.
No the ECU would not be happy. You need to modify the ECU code and switch off the DPF function.


Been reading that ash can be reverse flushed out of a DPF, using water or hot water or pressure washer. Apparently Peugeot owners have been doing it for years. See for example Peugeot 406 Coupe - new methods of cleaning diesel particulate filter? | Technical matters | Back Room Forum | Honest John (http://www.honestjohn.co.uk/forum/post/index.htm?t=91801) DPF Removal and Clean Guide - Peugeot Forums (http://www.peugeotforums.com/forums/engine-53/dpf-removal-clean-guide-18052/). Only hassle appears that the engine or subframe might have to be dropped to get the DPF out for a VAG TDI.
Looking at the internals of the DPF I don't really see any reason why you couldn't wash it out or blow out the ash. You do not have to remove the subframe to the the DPF out of a Mk5 Golf. I disconnected the front right drive shaft, that gave us enough room to drop it out the bottom.


Getting caught on the other hand is a whole different story. The pink slip tests do not currently include an emissions test so unless it's belching a pile of black smoke and the testing agent thinks it's "too much" it's unlikely to be questioned. Ditto for most other enforcement bodies... it is diesel after all... That said, things are changing and more and more diesel cars emit less and less smoke making the likely hood of standing out more of a threat.
Exactly, very unlikely to get caught.

[MidnightDog]

Hmm. Interesting. I don't have the skills to do a DPF-delete myself, but if I can't figure out any other way to get around this perhaps I'll look into it. The thought had occurred to me that visually there would be no way of knowing, but I didn't realise pink slips had no emissions test - seems pretty surprising to me that there's no real enforcement mechanism in place, given the size of the fine.

I guess for now I'll just try to get this sensor replaced and hope for the best. Sounds like that might require an investment in a cable and some VCDS software - perhaps I'd be able to run it through Boot Camp on my Mac. I'll post an update when something's happened.