Rocco Vs Competitors

[Vwphile]

I've test driven the Rocco and agree with all the comments I've read on this forum. It has great performance, handles as if its on rails. I absolutely love the exhaust burble as it changes up through the gears in the DSG version.

So I'm a convert.

But just to make sure I haven't missed any obvious competitors (apart from its own siblings) have any you driven either the
Renault Megane Cup 250
Mazda MX5
Mini Cooper S

and how they compare with the Roc

Would greatly appreciate your thoughts.

Also manual VS DSG in the Rocco?

[Mac135]

Not quite sure why you think an MX5 is a competitor but if you were going to stretch the list of competitors a bit then I'd consider adding the following:

The sister cars Golf GTI and R
Audi S3
Alfa Guiletta (adds 2 doors but is a quickisg hatch)
Alfa Brera coupe more a cruiser perhaps?
Audi TT plenty of reviews compare the two cars
BMW 1 coupe
If you are including the Cooper then perhaps the citroen DS3 Sport
Mazda RX8
Peugeot RCZ
Nissan 370Z
Volvo C30

The R isn't going to win a comparison on all counts against this line up. The Nissan or a 135 would stretch it in a straight line for example but as a 135 owner I think an R could well be a better daily drive being a little more practical, a little livelier, a little more efficient etc.

The R stacks up well in my view but like everything making a choice from the group above will come down to compromise.

[Andych]

I have to agree with Mac135... out of the original list... I could only seriously take the Renault as a competitor.. it is a touch cheaper and most likely faster but I think it would be harder to live with on a daily basis.
The Mini... nope
The MX5... a long way from being competition IMO anyway..

[Mac135]

I think the Golf R a genuine competitor and probably the car to have it you needed 4 doors in a compact performance package.

[Vwphile]

Not quite sure why you think an MX5 is a competitor

MX5 and Roc are two door fun cars that handle well and are at Similar price point. Admittedly, one drives from the front and the other from the rear, the MX5 is a 2 seater but I won't be carrying more than one passanger anyway so not a deal breaker

[triode12]

I've test driven the Rocco and agree with all the comments I've read on this forum. It has great performance, handles as if its on rails. I absolutely love the exhaust burble as it changes up through the gears in the DSG version.

So I'm a convert.

But just to make sure I haven't missed any obvious competitors (apart from its own siblings) have any you driven either the
Renault Megane Cup 250
Mazda MX5
Mini Cooper S

and how they compare with the Roc

Would greatly appreciate your thoughts.

Also manual VS DSG in the Rocco?

I have driven both the Rocco (DSG) and Renault 250 Cup Trophee (manual of course).
Technically speaking the Renault would beat the Rocco in terms of handling esp on the twisties. This is the car you want to get if you plan to go on the track a lot. BUT...I personally would get the Rocco because I don't go to the track that often and would get bored driving the 250 as a daily - the 250 just isn't fun to drive. You have to push the 250 a lot more, hence to license losing speeds to get the same fun feeling you get from the Rocco at legal speeds. The 250 is just too composed/too good - you don't get the feeling of speed till you get over 140 km/hr.

Also, the 250 feels cheap on the inside compared to the Rocco. The only redeeming feature of the 250 is the v.cool built-in telemetry ala Nissan GT-R. Not to forget the very bad reputation for reliability and resale value of the frog brands.


.

---------- Post added at 05:21 PM ---------- Previous post was at 05:19 PM ----------


[QUOTE=Mac135;775107]Not quite sure why you think an MX5 is a competitor

MX5 and Roc are two door fun cars that handle well and are at Similar price point. Admittedly, one drives from the front and the other from the rear, the MX5 is a 2 seater but I won't be carrying more than one passanger anyway so not a deal breaker


You also forgot that one is turbo charged while the other is NA.
I would drive both and make up your mind. The NC MX5 is due to be superceeded next year. So you might get a good runout deal on one if you wait till the end of the year.

[Andych]

I think the Golf R a genuine competitor and probably the car to have it you needed 4 doors in a compact performance package.
Personally... I thought the Golf R was the ducks guts when it was released... mean looking etc but I was in with my dealer today sorting a couple of things out and they had a CW fully loaded Golf R together with a Viper Green Roc and a CW Roc and to be honest... the Golf is very plain looking now... it is amazing how wide the Roc looks or should I say how small the Golf looks.
The Golf seats are tiny and you feel like you would be bumping shoulders with your passenger.... plus surprisingly the Golf felt almost claustrophobic where before I felt it was a nice spacious cabin....

And I was trying to be objective about it as well. The other scary thing is... the Golf was well over $70K drive away as it sat on the floor...and all it had over my Rocco was front parking sensors and the RVC.. which mine will get.

[Mac135]

Agree with your points re the Golf. There does seem to be a width to the Roc. Not sure if it is real or imagined.

I hope that feeling of space or airiness increases with the sunroof fitted. I'm yet to sit in a Roc with one fitted.

I see you were expecting your car early Feb. Seems to have slipped a bit?

[entice]

You must have sat in a LWB version of the Roc. As i did teh 2 yesterday.
light, good looking (get rid of teh badge on the front) and wide stance are what the roc has over teh R
Spaciousness, rear seats (usable) and boot) useable and loadable is what the R has over the Roc.

you'll be happy with either.
you'll be happy for less with the Megane

but thats just MHO

[Mac135]

[QUOTE=Mac135;775107]Not quite sure why you think an MX5 is a competitor

MX5 and Roc are two door fun cars that handle well and are at Similar price point. Admittedly, one drives from the front and the other from the rear, the MX5 is a 2 seater but I won't be carrying more than one passanger anyway so not a deal breaker

ok I understand. I don't see them as competitors but get that they represent alternatives for you.

On the manual vs DSG ? The Dsg is a great option. It works well and I think still connects you tom the car in the way a torque convertor auto can't. Especially since VW updated the DSG feel some time ago (since I owned by DSG GTI). DSG takes awhile tom really get the feel of. If you do go the DSG route makes sure you put it into M and use the stick and paddles. In my view the DSG should only be used as an auto in traffic- once on the move it paddles and stick.

[tee_off]

+1. Only reason why I wanted a golf was 'coz the rocco wasn't available. Now that it is, where I could've got a golf by now, I'm waiting til end of next year to get a Scirocco.

I took a photo of an R and Scirocco side by side at a dealership and they appear the same width. The Scirocco isn't as tall and has a slittier grille which makes it look wider. Can't be bothered to check the official dimensions...


...they had a CW fully loaded Golf R together with a Viper Green Roc and a CW Roc and to be honest... the Golf is very plain looking now... it is amazing how wide the Roc looks or should I say how small the Golf looks.



Agree with your points re the Golf. There does seem to be a width to the Roc. Not sure if it is real or imagined.

[Andych]

+1. Only reason why I wanted a golf was 'coz the rocco wasn't available. Now that it is, where I could've got a golf by now, I'm waiting til end of next year to get a Scirocco.

I took a photo of an R and Scirocco side by side at a dealership and they appear the same width. The Scirocco isn't as tall and has a slittier grille which makes it look wider. Can't be bothered to check the official dimensions...

I am pretty sure it is 20mm wider in track at the front and 40 mm wider at the rear... bodywork is wider to the same degree at the front..

[ZIO]

Agree with your points re the Golf. There does seem to be a width to the Roc. Not sure if it is real or imagined.

I hope that feeling of space or airiness increases with the sunroof fitted. I'm yet to sit in a Roc with one fitted.

I see you were expecting your car early Feb. Seems to have slipped a bit?

Sunroof definitely helps with the space factor - wouldn't go back on that decision!

[tee_off]

Well the latest Wheels is out, and guess what the cover story is??

[sc77]

[QUOTE=tee_off;775950]Well the latest Wheels is out, and guess what the cover story is??[/

They'll change their minds when bits start falling off the megane and they get 50% resale in 3 years....ouch

[preeman]

Not really a Competitor but I ended up lined up next to a C63 AMG.
I didn't expect him to take off but he did, he had a jump on me but still even getting to 70 he pulled away by about a car length.

So moral of the story, C63 AMG is quicker :)

[Mac135]

Sunroof definitely helps with the space factor - wouldn't go back on that decision!

Great an other good decision of mine....on a roll!

---------- Post added at 08:37 PM ---------- Previous post was at 08:27 PM ----------


[QUOTE=tee_off;775950]Well the latest Wheels is out, and guess what the cover story is??[/

They'll change their minds when bits start falling off the megane and they get 50% resale in 3 years....ouch

Haven't seen wheels yet but I presume it is a comparison and the Megane wins?

Funny thing for me is that while I know that the Megane is the logical competitor I would NEVER have considered it. I just can't see a Renault, even a good one like the Megane still on my drive.

[Andych]

Great an other good decision of mine....on a roll!

Mate... you are going to love it when it finally gets here...
The one thing I would have optioned if I had been able to is Dynaudio.. while the standard sound is OK for FM radio I find it a little lacking in the bass department and tonal adjustments for MDI music.

I tried a particular song (Maroon 5 - Moves like Jagger) that makes very good use of nice bass etc.. and I just couldn't feel anything... so I guess I will be looking at what I can do to pump the sound a little.

[Mac135]

At least there a lots of good aftermarket audio options. Its not like you have to have the Dyn or your life is ruined.

Something else to research and get excited about- no bad thing

[Vwphile]

Got my new Wheels mag in the post yesterday. Had a review of the Roc Vs Megane RS.

Check out the cover headline: "RS Vs R: You'll never want a WRX again"

I won't spoil the result for those who want to read it first. But what do you guys think?

[Bain]

Spoil it for us! Ill never read a Wheels magazine.. hehe

[Andych]

They are a bit biased as they ran the Roc against their Long Term RS250 Trophy.... plus they still whine about the suspension being too hard and getting "kickback" from the steering when encountering mid corner bumps (potholes) when going for it... no doubt in sport mode but not confirmed.
They say "everything in the Renault is right". That would be all apart from the fact it is a little bit slower and thirstier...not to mention the horrendous re-sale and higher servicing costs...

As I said... I think it was a biased view.. or am I biased because I have my Roc... :banana:

[Mac135]

Renault Megane 250 = top car no doubt
Scirocco R = my car :party:

I'm happy and will be happier still in about four months

[tee_off]

They list the Megane's resale as 50% somewhere but in showroom it's 60? Also in showroom they say DSG is AWD??

[Andych]

They list the Megane's resale as 50% somewhere but in showroom it's 60? Also in showroom they say DSG is AWD??
While the Wheels info is probably the best on the resale value (nominated as Redbook) they certainly don't get info correct... they list the Roc as a 5 seater.. :facepalm:

Renault across the board have poor resale due to quality issues.. real or perceived... where VW have lately had the sort of resale and reliability record many dream of.

[Vwphile]

I'm still not committed to getting a Roc yet.

I know this is blasphemy in this forum but I'm seriously considering a 2012 BM 328. Its 4 cyl turbo gives similar performance to the ROC (0 to 100km/h ROC 6.0sec, BM 6.1sec) but with better fuel economy (ROC 8.2l/100km, BM 6.3l/100km). Yes, I know it will be about 20K more expensive (BUT NO Luxury Car Tax due to its low fuel consumption, unlike fully optioned ROC). The early reviews have been quite glowing:- Sporty handling, agile, terrific performance and with 4 doors.

I'm not really sure I can live with 2 doors again. Had a 2 door Civic in my younger days and it was a bit of a pain. And I love the gadgets on the BM328 such as the head up display, cameras that can give you a 360 degree view and...............RWD, leather and a sunroof that opens!!

Hey you diehard VDubbers, can you talk me out of it!

[AdamD]

I'm not really sure I can live with 2 doors again. Had a 2 door Civic in my younger days and it was a bit of a pain.

Same - I had a '97 EJ Civic 2 door. Loved it, but damn having just 2 doors was a right PITA. Hence why I went the 5dr GTI. You could get yourself a Golf R if you want Roc performance (or better thanks to AWD grip), for a lot less cash than the Beemer.

I've got to agree with you though - the new 328 sounds like a fantastic car.

[Bain]

- the new 328 sounds like a fantastic car.

On paper the specs are nice. It's a pity it looks so dull!

[Mac135]

The 328 will be a great car no doubt ande will be the leader in the small exec market.

I'm leaving BM because in part the ownership experience was not that fantastic relative to the $ spent. Also the new Bimmers also feel awfully removed from the actual driving of the car. I'm not saying by getting the ROC the VW is back to basics choice for me (I ordered a DSG for a start!) and in 2012 I think only a Caterham or Lotus can do that for you but I think (believe) I feel more connected in the R than any recent BM.

[mr gee]

Here's one from Best Motoring ...kinda like Top Gear Japan , pity they have killed the series

Best motoring May 2010 VW Scirocco R vs GTI R vs EVO ralliart vs STI Spec C - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zu3HjJcOBb8)

[shakespeare]

*Thread revive!* :) Info on a comparative drive of a Scirocco

I thought I'd post my impressions from the VW Evolution driver day on the weekend here in Perth.

If you're thinking of getting a Roc and don't mind the 2 doors, 4 seats then go for it. I drove one back to back on Saturday against a Golf R and whilst I own a Golf R, I was seriously thinking I would be very happy in the Roc. Firstly turn in is sharper, corner speeds are higher and rolling acceleration is quicker - this was on a dry track btw. Overall it felt more nimble than the Golf R (and it should for the 120kgs less) and it was (for me) a lot easier to push harder. Most importantly it was a lot more fun to throw around and was quite tail happy at times.

AWD vs FWD not a concern and as a FWD the Roc is very well sorted, maybe in the wet it would be a different story, anyway my 2 cents for those interested. If I didn't have children, or the need to be able to drive clients around then the Roc would be my daily.

[BS_roc]

I recently went through the same process and ended up with 2 on short list being Roc and RS250 and in the end wasnt even close once I drove the DSG, only go with the RS250 if you want to do a lot of hard work behind the wheel to get the same smiile the Roc gives doing 60km/h

[Prodigy]

I fully agree with Shakespeare (i was at the same driver day as him) i was very impressed with the Scirocco and had a more enjoyable time driving it on the track than i did the Golf. I have even visited a local VW dealer to get prices on the Roc i was that impressed.