Distributor Advance Curve

[vanders87]

Here's an interesting project someone might be interested in. I'm running a 1.8L from a mk3 golf in the TS Passat ('75) and currently i'm using the distributor from the 1.5L i took out. I've built up some electronics to run the 1.8L distributor which is a hall effect sensor triggered system. The problem is, I need to program the advance curve into the module for this to work and I don't know what it is! I was hoping somebody would be able to point me in the right direction for the advance curve for the ts distributor or the mk3 electronic system curve. Either would be a great starting point as currently i have none!

Cheers
Philip

[Golf Loon]

I dont know anything about the curve, but you could use a TCIH module from a Golf 2 GTI or Audi 80 and the corresponding dissy, or your electronic one. They have the same engine and the elctronic bits already exist.

[Jmac]

110% agree with Golf Loon mate. Thats the way to go. Although you will need to keep a spare tci. They were common for breaking
Cheers
Jmac

[Peter Jones]

If you're using the original dizzy surely you'd just set the module at 0° and let the dizzy do the work?

Otherwise lock out the advance in the dizzy, or use a Mk3 dizzy with no internal advance and set the module up to pull in 30° by around 3000rpm.

That should OK as a starting point. If it pings dial back the total advance or up the rpms.

At least that's the approach I'd take.


Pete

[aprr32]

It's not the module that controls the advance it's engine ecu! J Car used make a programmable advance control box for many types of ignitions.

[vanders87]

on that note, i'm using a set of jaycar kits to make a complete stand-alone ignition system

[Jmac]

Jaycar has some very interesting and surprisingly good gadgets. Im going to be wiring up an interceptor soon for turbo boost cutting bypass and also a fuel trimmer.
Jmac

[Peter Jones]

on that note, i'm using a set of jaycar kits to make a complete stand-alone ignition system


Just had a look at those. By the looks of it you can program it to change the advance curve. This might be just what I'm after. I could use it to run the 2.0 dizzy in my MK 1 and not have to worry about all the mechanical adaption issues. Mmmmmm could even use the MK3 Knock sensor too..........


Pete

[Preen59]

Just had a look at those. By the looks of it you can program it to change the advance curve. This might be just what I'm after. I could use it to run the 2.0 dizzy in my MK 1 and not have to worry about all the mechanical adaption issues. Mmmmmm could even use the MK3 Knock sensor too..........


Pete

You crazy electronics whizz's with your crazy ideas... :bowdown::bowdown:

Would i be able to run something like this for the 16v?? Sounds like a cheap (price not quality) ignition system..

[Peter Jones]

You crazy electronics whizz's with your crazy ideas... :bowdown::bowdown:

Would i be able to run something like this for the 16v?? Sounds like a cheap (price not quality) ignition system..


Don't see why not. You've basically got the same problem I've got.

You want to run a motor which has no inbuilt advance in it's electronic distributor right? ... and it's a PITA to make or adapt a mech advance unit in it's place.

Looks like the kit should be able to pick up the hall effect unit no problems, should even be able to trigger the factory ign unit I'm using or drive the coil directly. You can add on a kit to retard timing based on input from a knock sensor too which might be fun.

Might have to see if I've got the Mag it was published in.

Here's the links
http://www.jaycar.com.au/productView.asp?ID=KC5442&CATID=25&keywords=&SPECIAL=&form=CAT&ProdCodeOnly=&Keyword1=&Keyword2=&pageNumber=&priceMin=&priceMax=&SUBCATID=347

http://www.jaycar.com.au/productView.asp?ID=KC5443&CATID=25&keywords=&SPECIAL=&form=CAT&ProdCodeOnly=&Keyword1=&Keyword2=&pageNumber=&priceMin=&priceMax=&SUBCATID=347

http://www.jaycar.com.au/productView.asp?ID=KC5444&CATID=25&keywords=&SPECIAL=&form=CAT&ProdCodeOnly=&Keyword1=&Keyword2=&pageNumber=&priceMin=&priceMax=&SUBCATID=347


Pete

[Peter Jones]

Bit more here

http://www.siliconchip.com.au/cms/A_108521/article.html

I'll see what I can dig up.

Pete

[Preen59]

Don't see why not. You've basically got the same problem I've got.

You want to run a motor which has no inbuilt advance in it's electronic distributor right? ... and it's a PITA to make or adapt a mech advance unit in it's place.

Looks like the kit should be able to pick up the hall effect unit no problems, should even be able to trigger the factory ign unit I'm using or drive the coil directly. You can add on a kit to retard timing based on input from a knock sensor too which might be fun.

Might have to see if I've got the Mag it was published in.

Here's the links
http://www.jaycar.com.au/productView.asp?ID=KC5442&CATID=25&keywords=&SPECIAL=&form=CAT&ProdCodeOnly=&Keyword1=&Keyword2=&pageNumber=&priceMin=&priceMax=&SUBCATID=347

http://www.jaycar.com.au/productView.asp?ID=KC5443&CATID=25&keywords=&SPECIAL=&form=CAT&ProdCodeOnly=&Keyword1=&Keyword2=&pageNumber=&priceMin=&priceMax=&SUBCATID=347

http://www.jaycar.com.au/productView.asp?ID=KC5444&CATID=25&keywords=&SPECIAL=&form=CAT&ProdCodeOnly=&Keyword1=&Keyword2=&pageNumber=&priceMin=&priceMax=&SUBCATID=347


Pete

I'm liking that system very much. :)

One question though... What do you use to change the advance curve programming??

[Peter Jones]

You use their "Hand controller" which is a seperate Kit.

I've PDF'd up a copy of the original article PM me with an e-mail address if you'd like me to send you a copy. I'll see if I can dig up all the follow up articles.

Pete

[Peter Jones]

To answer the original question ... this controller can map out the original advance curve of the stock distributor.

Pete

[Peter Jones]

I've found all the relevant Silicon Chip articles now (Part 1, 2, 3 and the knock sensor) If any one want a copy PM me with an e-mail address to send them through to.

Looks like a pretty versatile system, should work fine with the the post Mk3 motors to let you remove the FI and still drive the ignition. (ie 2.0 into Mk1 with carbs, 16v with carbs etc.)

Very comprehensive arcticle, even if you're not considering this system it's a good insight into the issues.

Pete

[vanders87]

So back to the point.... i've built all the kits from jaycar. I'm after the advance curve for the stock distributor so i can program the module. If no one knows I'll just have to get a timing light and record it all off the dizzy.

[Peter Jones]

Does the dizzy have built in advance? If so you just let the dizzy do the advancing by setting all the maps at 0°.

If you're going to lock out the advance you'll need to map it out. A gas conversion place might have the ability to map a distributor, some auto elecs have the gear too.

Look forward to hearing how it goes.

Pete

[Peter Jones]

I just found all the MK1 advance curves in the Bentley Manual. Can someone look up a MK 3 Bentley and find us an answer?


Pete