Timing Belt - Once and for All

[dubbed]

I'm making this post in the hope of helping myself as well as other MKIV owners about something we should all be aware of.

So if you own or are planning on buying a MKIV you would have done your research (I hope) and know that the timing belt is prone to failure i.e. snapping causing severe engine damage, hence the belt should be replaced at 80,000-100,000kms. It's probably the biggest service in the life of a MKIV, so whilst doing this job the waterpump should also be replaced with one that has a metal impellor as the OEM part has a plastic impellor. Along with this it's a good time to replace the tensioner because the pulley is susceptible to seizing.

I've had one quote so far from a VW specialist in Melbourne for about $1,500 including oil/filter change. I've had another quote for just labour from someone who does it at home for just under a third of that cost (includes changing thermostat, bleeding the coolant system etc).

Now, for those of you who have done this, can you please list how much you paid, what you got done, and where you got it done? It'd be good to get first-hand experiences in this area as there doesn't seem to be any definitive answer.

PS: Sorry if any of my information is wrong. I am also assuming that this issue effects the 1.6l, 1.8l turbo, and 2.0l (3.2l V6 uses a timing chain so it shouldn't need replacing unless something goes wrong or it's racked up lots of kms - thanks qsilvera :)).

Update: I just spoke to AUDI Spares (very friendly by the way) who quoted ~$900 for the timing belt, water pump, coolant etc. The guy I spoke to said that the water pumps need replacing approxmiately every four years so having a metal impellor isn't as important like people make it out to be... Although I've heard the opposite. They'd cover the cost in the event of a failure anyway.

[qsilverza]

3.2 L V6 and 2.8 L use Timing chains, dont really need to be replaced until about.... never :) But the american guys have been talking anywhere from 120,000 Miles to 200,000 +.

[spa]

I'm quite interested in this too, now that I'm >80000 :|

[Mr Messy]

Should the T-belt etc be done earlier if chipped?

Also are the recommended service intervals okay?
I considered a 306 GTI6 for a while but they are sooooooooo much trouble with belt snapping etc and the Peugeot intervals aren't good enough.

[ope126]

Answer...

Ring your local "friendly" VW service department, they will tell you 4 years or 60,000kms. :idea:

or

Refer to your owners handbook. :duh:
Mine owners manual includes a service schedule supplement, that states that it should be replaced 4 years or 60,000kms.

Mine was done at 63,000kms at Camberwell Volkswagen. :driver:
Price around $1500. (incl. water pump)

I trust this helps!

[Jmac]

Always has been 4 yrs or 90k mate and i wouldnt do it any later than that. Not sure where the 60k came from unless you have a sticker in your book, some do . No hesitation do the water pump with metal impellar, tensioner (a given) Belt and 90% of the time the hydraulic dampner, now thats for the 5V Agu and the likes for the 1.6 all the above apart from the dampner. Diesel up to 2000 60k and after 2000 90k or 4yrs which ever comes 1st.
Cheers
Jmac(VW/Audi/Porsche Tech):biggrin:

[Mrk_Mickey]

3.2 L V6 and 2.8 L use Timing chains, dont really need to be replaced until about.... never :) But the american guys have been talking anywhere from 120,000 Miles to 200,000 +.

Just for the record, a timing chain will Definitely need to be replaced at some point. My V6 golf has done 175,000km and my timing chain rails/guides were snapped when i went to replace them. VW said that the chains should last the life of the car. Chains, perhaps. Not the plastic guides.

[blutopless2]

am getting our nbc serviced next week.
its 5 years old and done 60,000k's. asked about the timing belt change and was told about the water pump impeller problem etc... so will have belt, pump, tensioner etc all changed. will be interesting to see what it costs.

[blue_reality]

$680 for timing belt and water pump and full service at a Euro Car specialist in Sydney. A VW specific service place said $750 just for timing belt, pump and service on top of that so we were stoked with $680. (That also included new spark plugs etc)

That's for a MK4 GTI. We were very happy with that price.

[dubbed]

Geeeeze that's an excellent price. It's almost worth the trip up :P

I've also found somewhere in my service book that the 'toothed belt' was replaced at 60 odd thousand kms in '05. Is this the timing belt or accessories/serpentine belt? If it's the timing belt I might leave it until the start of next year.

[Jmac]

Toothed belt is the timing belt pal
Jmac

[dubbed]

I thought so. Cheers Jmac :) You're a gun! Now I can put half of the money away and get myself a present finally whu hu!

[McDub]

I just purchased an '03 GTI, wich has had this service.
all standard servicing was done by VW, but this was done bysome random auto repairer. according to the receipt, they tried changing the thermostat first to see what caused the over heating:

coolant - 38
thermostat - 15
hose clips - 3
timing belt - 140
water pump - 190
car hours - 200
total = $644 incl gst.

not bad compared to the $1500 mentioned in this thread!

[dubbed]

Well the quote I had sounds absurd. I wonder if the price was bumped up because my girlfriend was the one asking about it... It pays to shop around!

Thanks to those who have contributed. I'm sure the information will be handy to many.

[qsilverza]

I can agree with that, but I have heard that you can hear the chains going long before they do...


Just for the record, a timing chain will Definitely need to be replaced at some point. My V6 golf has done 175,000km and my timing chain rails/guides were snapped when i went to replace them. VW said that the chains should last the life of the car. Chains, perhaps. Not the plastic guides.

[JustCruisn]

Water Pump $105
Damper Tension belt $119
Timing Belt $68
Thermostat $22.27
Tensioner T/Belt $82.25
Coolant $34.20
Labour $80/hr $346.40

Total $777.12
German Autos Geebung

Mine only made it to 70752km before the pump shat itself. :duh:
They flushed and strained all the coolant until all bits of the plastic impeller were located.

[blutopless2]

well got our new beetle cabrio back from servicing today...
60000k service, timing belt, tensioner, water pump.
new battery and code clearing for airbags (low voltage due to battery dying)
total of $910.

[Bug_racer]

Thats getting a little too cheap . I would be making sure all parts are replaced as well , seen it many times parts are charged but never replaced


Also , am I the only one changing power steering fluid as well ??




I just purchased an '03 GTI, wich has had this service.
all standard servicing was done by VW, but this was done bysome random auto repairer. according to the receipt, they tried changing the thermostat first to see what caused the over heating:

coolant - 38
thermostat - 15
hose clips - 3
timing belt - 140
water pump - 190
car hours - 200
total = $644 incl gst.

not bad compared to the $1500 mentioned in this thread!

[No457 Snowy]

Thats getting a little too cheap . I would be making sure all parts are replaced as well , seen it many times parts are charged but never replaced


Also , am I the only one changing power steering fluid as well ??

Seb's got a very good point there, it's the same with anything, you can pay too much and be ripped off, but you can also pay too little and still be ripped off because things weren't done properly or replaced.

It's amazing to see price variations for the same standard maintenance job.


Snowy. :)

[Mrk_Mickey]

I can agree with that, but I have heard that you can hear the chains going long before they do...

Yeah this is true. Sorry for the off-topic post guys; you'll usually hear the chains going as a result of dodgy placement of chains, ie bad rails/guides etc. i think it's a lot more rare if the chains themselves break, but they do. that would be catastrophic! :eek:

[Jmac]

$910 for all of that which includes the service is WAY to cheap. got to be somethings missed there for sure and i would reckon important items. Seb you are not the only one doing the power steering fluid mate. I have posted on here many times about my opinions on shelf life of oils like Zf trannies and the likes, but you are right next to no one does it and loads of stuff gets missed. There is being cheap and being cheap and thorough.
Cheers
Jmac

[Mr Messy]

I collected my MK4 after a big service at Camden GTI today. I had the T-belt, tensioner and water pump replaced as well as a full service.

It was done in good time for well less than $900, which I thought was very resonable.

I was happy I went with a new metal water pump as unbeknownst to me the original plastic unit had broken impeller blades (that were fished out of the car's coolant system) and wasn't far from failure. I might upload pix on another day.

I've gotta praise Matthew and co for doing a great job at a good price and not patronising me despite my limited knowledge of the MK4. Hurrah!

P.S it's off topic but my air con was broken and was sorted for another $100 or so (!!!) spent on gas and replacing faulty electrical connections. This easy fix was a lovely surprise as I was planning to dump money saved for a re-flash into a new A/C compressor. Woo!

[Jmac]

Been low on gas then mate, you must have a leak somewhere, keep an eye on that. Good work changing that pump, nearly every one i have looked at has been stuffed,cracked, split or crumbling. Metal one is the way to go.
JMac

[Mr Messy]

Cheers.
How do I keep an eye on the air con gas???

[Jmac]

Couple of things mate im sure Matt would have put some Dye in with the R134A mate so thats 1 way and the other is AC performance gets poor again, thats a sure sign mate, but if you were needing gas its going somewhere.
Cheers

[dubbed]

You must be chuffed, Mr Messy! It's a good feeling when you find a decent workshop that treats you individually and doesn't charge you an arm and a leg.

[Mr Messy]

Yep, very happy :) And glad i didn't have to put $1000+ into air conditioning.

[HOLEIN1]

hate to dig up this thread again, but was hoping someone with some experience such as jmac can point me in the right direction...

doing the timing belt next weekend (well a mechanic friend is anyway) so need to order all my parts tomorrow in time for the weekend...

basically this is my list, however was wondering if there is anything else under the timing cover or is part of the process which could be replaced as a precaution - dont want to rip everything apart again if something else goes wrong :)

also would like to do as much as i can for piece of mind as after this is done there will be a few mods being done such as ECU etc.... here goes...

1)timing belt
2)timing belt tensioner
3)water pump with metal impeller
4)coolant
5)thermostat
6)accessory belt

i believe athat there is also a idler pulley in there - is this worth doing? is there any seals etc etc that could be replaced?

also would it be worth doing the accessory belt tensioner, or is this something that can be easily replaced at a later stage if it were to fail?

bit confused, as when i was considering taking it to a VW specialist they were only going to change the belt and water pump - realistically are my plans a bit of an overkill?

sorry about all the questions, but will probably be handy for others who find this thread :) oh, the car has just ticked over 80k if thats relevant

much thanks, dan :)

[HOLEIN1]

just had a look through a few threads on vortex and was wondering if the idler pulley is part of the tensioner assembly? or are they seperate parts which need to be bought?

im referring to the last two pics on this page...

http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=2840728&page=3

the thread also mentions a harmonic balancer pulley, should this be replaced also? my god, i didint realise that there were so many parts under there!

:)