Suspension upgrades & custom valves exhaust

[GT2260s]

Hello all, long time reader but first time poster.

Have had a history of MKV R32s, MK6 Rs and now a 2021 Passat B8 206tsi.

This is a stage 3 car with all the supporting mods with the smaller of the Garrett powermax turbos retaining a similar spool to the factory turbo. Has been dyno’d at 280kw atw.

Anyway, a couple of questions. Have been looking at exhausts for a long time so ended up buying a valvetronic dual muffler set up, but I need some custom work done anyone have any recommendations. I am in Melbourne’s NW area.

Also I am looking at getting bilstein shocks. I have the eibach pro springs with super pro rear sway bar with end links, but I believe the suspension is getting squeaky from all the speed humps around my area. Does anyone have any experience or feedback for me, is the squeaks coming from the shocks? Or is it something else

For shocks I am looking at the bilstein B8s, car has only done less than 40,000kms

Thanks guys!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Lucas_R]

The squeaks will be coming from the strut top bearings - my Mk7 Golf GTI had creaks when going over bumps with only 40,000km on it and when I replaced the strut bearings (also replaced the strut mounts for good measure) it was nice and quiet again. Its very common on the VW's.

These are the parts im talking about - note these are the parts for a Golf.....not sure if the Passat uses the same ones or not.

Strut bearings
SACHS Strut Bearing '-' VW Golf Mk7 GTI/R & Audi 8V A3/S3 | AutoInstruct (https://www.autoinstruct.com.au/product/sachs-strut-bearing-vw-golf-mk7-standard-gti-r-audi-8v-a3-s3/)

Strut mounts
SACHS Strut Mount '-' VW Golf Mk7 GTI/R & Audi 8V A3/S3 | AutoInstruct (https://www.autoinstruct.com.au/product/sachs-strut-mount-vw-golf-mk7-standard-gti-r-audi-8v-a3-s3/)

As for your exhaust, looks like there are several very good options in Melbourne. Depends on your location and budget I suppose. The price can vary greatly based on....
Material used (mild steel = cheap, stainless steel = expensive)
Bends - press bends = cheap/crap vs mandrel bends = good/much better flow but more expensive
Welding method - mig welding = quick and cheap but looks terrible vs tig welding which looks great but is slower and more expensive
Joins - basic flanges or v bands

- Hitech exhaust in Carrum Downs
- Exhaust world in North Melbourne
- Performance exhaust nationwide in Knoxville
- Extreme exhaust in Sunshine
- Classic Custom Exhaust in Coburg
etc etc etc the list goes on

Google Search for Custom Exhaust Melbourne (https://www.google.com/localservices/prolist?g2lbs=AOHF13knzGoyLfqmdXseKb__n4s1HiLz_Ozj MnPkcLTivWgojEcy42KeOL-eJV8CaDSA7syA5tXoaQ0xe0rnAPcys0uMD4RyckgZWNyVz9yA3 gIaaBkXfww%3D&hl=en-AU&gl=au&ssta=1&q=custom%20exhaust%20melbourne&oq=custom%20exhaust%20melbourne&slp=MgBSAggCYACSAZQCCgsvZy8xdGt2OXhqMwoLL2cvMXRmZ3 BqcG4KDC9nLzFwcDJ0bGpzeQoLL2cvMXRkM3JtdmsKDS9nLzEx dmxxOHkwODUKDS9nLzExczVmc2xtMnAKCy9nLzF0emx6MnYxCg svZy8xdGRmMWhmNgoLL2cvMXZmOWNodjkKDS9nLzExYmJ0bm4z cDAKCy9nLzF0ZGJ3d195CgsvZy8xdGdueGJfdwoNL2cvMTFyZ2 Z0bHIyNgoNL2cvMTFnNjlnbTgzdwoNL2cvMTF0NGd6eHY4OQoM L2cvMXB3Znhidms2CgsvZy8xdGc1Yzc2bQoLL2cvMXRmemd4Yz IKDS9nLzExZmszZDJtZjAKCy9nLzF0ZDNybXgwmgEGCgIXGRAA&src=2&serdesk=1&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjqxfKO-OaHAxU71zQHHaOIDfgQjGp6BAgpEAE&scp=ChFnY2lkOm11ZmZsZXJfc2hvcBJPEhIJ90260rVG1moRkM 2MIXVWBAQaEglPlRh-SzHUahE0lYK-4vxOWiINTWVsYm91cm5lIFZJQyoUDV91F-kVCkEvVh3fO6TpJShzu1YwABoOY3VzdG9tIGV4aGF1c3QiGGN1 c3RvbSBleGhhdXN0IG1lbGJvdXJuZSoVRXhoYXVzdCBTaWxlbm NlciBTaG9w)

[GT2260s]

Thanks Lucas_R.

Interesting that the likely culprits are the strut mounts and bearings. Is this labour intensive and a quick Google shows some 034 heavier duty items - is it better that I get these so I don’t have to change them every 40,000kms.

I did ring Exhaust World and Hi tech. I don’t think Hi tech bothers with the valved units but they do some good custom work but pricey.

Exhaust world use mild steel and then they heat coat it in black which is not ideal, but right now I’m just after the tone as the performance is enough anyway so I might end up going with Exhaust world as they are reasonably priced and do the valved unit install too.

Can’t wait for it to sound decent. I have a scorpion downpipe, custom mid pipe and res delete and with the standard mufflers it rattles so bad that it sounds like the exhaust is going to fall off!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[petemac110]

034 strut mounts/bearings have a mixed reputation, along with their engine mounts. I have no personal experience though so it's only hearsay.

The large circular rearmost bushes in the lower control arms are also contributors to noise - a well-known issue and VWAG have published multiple TSBs on how to treat these with a special lithium grease to stop them from binding and creating noise. My Passat suffered from binding bushes not long after I bought it second-hand, and the noises were horrible.

Interested to see how you go with your noises. My front end is still decidedly loose-feeling at times. I foresee new lower control arms and strut mounts/bearings in my near future.

[Lucas_R]

I would not recommend the 034 mounts/bearings. I installed those on my Golf and they rattled like hell……every.single.bump. Checked everything was tight several times but its just how they were - no thanks!!! Not for me.

Replaced them with the Sachs units linked above and they were like brand new again.

Its a 1hr job for a mechanic with a hoist and tools. Try TTY euro in Mordialloc if you are anywhere near that area.

As for exhaust - your factory exhaust is approx 2.5” diameter mandrel bent stainless steel, so if you want improved flow (probably necessary with your power level) then it needs to be better than this. So 3” mandrel bent at least. You can go for mild steel if budget doesn’t allow, but make sure it gets painted with black heat resistant paint to prevent/slow down rust.

[GT2260s]

Thanks guys. I will stick to the Sachs units. Sounds like they work a treat.

Another query. For a stage 3 car I am sure that the service guys have been using 5W30 oil, but thinking now that the car has done almost 40,000kms I might be better served using some motul 5W40 oil, think it’s 8100.

Given all the work done to the car I’ll likely keep it for another 2 years unless the cupra Leon sportstourer tempts me in a year’s time.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[GT2260s]

Alright got the car back from the workshop. The creaking noise is coming from the suspension, they are saying it is the bushes from the control arms from both front and rear. So kinda a similar problem to the strut bearings, it must be those rubber mounts/bushes are horrible.

The front one is starting to split under the load from the stiffer suspension and it makes me think that the Passat suspension parts are far inferior to the golf r as it’s meant to ride more as a family car - which is understandable.

On a different note, they are looking to measure up the custom exhaust so i am excited but also wary of the cost.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[petemac110]

Alright got the car back from the workshop. The creaking noise is coming from the suspension, they are saying it is the bushes from the control arms from both front and rear. So kinda a similar problem to the strut bearings, it must be those rubber mounts/bushes are horrible.

The front one is starting to split under the load from the stiffer suspension and it makes me think that the Passat suspension parts are far inferior to the golf r as it’s meant to ride more as a family car - which is understandable.



No, they are the exact same bushing material in the Golf R vs the Passat. Different bushes were used in some Audi models, and the Mk8 Golf has updated bushings.

You can apply a liberal application of silicone spray lubricant to those bushes, ensuring it penetrates as much as possible around the openings and interfaces of the bushes vs the suspension arms and crossmembers. This will tend to quieten things down a bit. I gave mine a spray a few weekends ago and the difference it makes to noise and the overall feel of the front end is quite significant. I need to do the rears soon.

[GT2260s]

I am thinking of getting the superpro bushes for the control arms front and rear. I already have a superpro rear sway bar and end links so it makes sense for me to go the same route? Anyone have any experience or recommendations with this?

I guess I just want to fix it and set and forget if that’s possible.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[petemac110]

Personally I'd steer away from poly bushes for the rear-most lower control arm bushes. Good info here (noting of course than any of the aftermarket Golf lower control arms won't fit the Passat, so you're limited to press-in replacement bushing assemblies only).

I'm likely to go down the path of fitting OEM Audi bushings with smaller voids myself.

Front LCA bushing options | GOLFMK7 - VW GTI MKVII Forum / VW Golf R Forum / VW Golf MKVII Forum (https://www.golfmk7.com/forums/index.php?threads/front-lca-bushing-options.437224/)

[GT2260s]

Ok thanks. I’ll see what the workshop says also. I think the parts are relatively cheap, but labour time is like 2hrs.

What car do you have, given all the issues with suspension noise and creaking?

I get my car as it’s lowered on eibach springs with sway bar and we have loads of speed bumps where we live.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[nermal]

My Arteon used to creak and squeak really bad, especially after rain.. I applied a lot of silicone spray to every suspension bush and bolt I could find/reach, which helped for a while until it came back after a little while.

I then applied a generous dose of OEM lithium grease the dealership gave me and haven't noticed any real creaks or squeaks since. There's a part number on the tube that I can find if you need it (it's currently packed away in a box).

[petemac110]

Ok thanks. I’ll see what the workshop says also. I think the parts are relatively cheap, but labour time is like 2hrs.

What car do you have, given all the issues with suspension noise and creaking?

I get my car as it’s lowered on eibach springs with sway bar and we have loads of speed bumps where we live.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

MY18 Passat 206TSI - about 82k on the clock.

The MQB chassis is a bit of a horror-show when it comes to suspension noises - common issues across the VWAG models based on this chassis designation i.e. a LOT!

[petemac110]

My Arteon used to creak and squeak really bad, especially after rain.. I applied a lot of silicone spray to every suspension bush and bolt I could find/reach, which helped for a while until it came back after a little while.

I then applied a generous dose of OEM lithium grease the dealership gave me and haven't noticed any real creaks or squeaks since. There's a part number on the tube that I can find if you need it (it's currently packed away in a box).

Yep, the lithium grease works well if the rear lower control arm bushes are binding and causing noises. I mentioned this a bit earlier in the thread along with the TSB doc. Definitely worth checking out this solution.

[GT2260s]

Funny you say that about the lithium grease. I went back to the dealership a couple of times on the sunroof creaking. They applied the grease, it was still there a couple of months later, but I haven’t noticed it recently.

I still think my bushes are starting to split so may be good to replace them anyway.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[GT2260s]

@petemac the Passat is a good all rounder car. But you can definitely tell that although it’s a lot of car for the money there are some components where it shows that they have gone down the cheaper route. Doesn’t feel as solid as what it should be. I came from a SQ5 and the build quality is noticeably different.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[petemac110]

@petemac the Passat is a good all rounder car. But you can definitely tell that although it’s a lot of car for the money there are some components where it shows that they have gone down the cheaper route. Doesn’t feel as solid as what it should be. I came from a SQ5 and the build quality is noticeably different.



What you describe is common to cars across the VW, Audi and Skoda brands which use the MQB chassis. It's not Passat-specific. It's not so much that they've gone down the cheaper route with the Passat as such - they are simply limited by the chassis. The Passats do use some nicer bits vs other MQB models e.g. the cast aluminium front subframe) but there's no getting around the limitations, nay flaws, of the MQB chassis and suspension.

The SQ5 is based on the MLB platform and has a different chassis and suspension design so I'm not surprised it feels different.

[Lucas_R]

@petemac the Passat is a good all rounder car. But you can definitely tell that although it’s a lot of car for the money there are some components where it shows that they have gone down the cheaper route. Doesn’t feel as solid as what it should be. I came from a SQ5 and the build quality is noticeably different.

The SQ5 is a beast. Ive got a 2015 Audi SQ5 which has just rolled over 100,000km and its so bloody rock solid. Such a well built car. Have owned it for about 6 years now (bought at 3yrs old from original owner).


What you describe is common to cars across the VW, Audi and Skoda brands which use the MQB chassis. It's not Passat-specific. It's not so much that they've gone down the cheaper route with the Passat as such - they are simply limited by the chassis. The Passats do use some nicer bits vs other MQB models e.g. the cast aluminium front subframe) but there's no getting around the limitations, nay flaws, of the MQB chassis and suspension.

The SQ5 is based on the MLB platform and has a different chassis and suspension design so I'm not surprised it feels different.

Also dont forget that the Passat is several hundred kilos heavier than other cars in the MQB chassis range such as a Golf, yet it is fitted with the same suspension bushes, so makes sense that they would wear out more quickly when the are working harder.

[petemac110]

Also dont forget that the Passat is several hundred kilos heavier than other cars in the MQB chassis range such as a Golf, yet it iss fitted with the same suspension bushes, so makes sense that they would wear out more quickly when the are working harder.

Very, very good point that!

[GT2260s]

Ok somewhat of an update but not necessarily a solution.

I decided I got annoyed enough by the noises so I asked the workshop what they would do. They said since it’s so labour intensive that if they put new bushings in, they might as well replace the control arms (standard OEM ones) mind you - at about a cost of $2k.

So replacing bushes and control arms every 40k kms is not really justifiable so I did a little more research and here goes the theory.

I have updated superpro sway bars, end links and stiffer lower eibach springs. In theory this puts more pressure on all elements of the suspension which kinda holds true. Because my wife drives the car daily I had the individual settings as sport for engine/gearbox but the lowest setting for DCC dampening > lower than standard comfort.

This in theory must be putting a lot of pressure on the dampers and therefore bushes and all other suspension components.

So I put my settings to sport for DCC and lo and behold in 95% of the cases the creaking is gone. So it doesn’t remove the fact that my bushes are worn and will need replacing but I’m almost certain that if I had left DCC in sport that the rest of the other components in the suspension eg bushes,shocks wouldn’t have had to work as hard to compensate for the softer ride whilst I put in stiffer components such as sway bars and springs.

Does that sound right?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Mattyj73350]

Was there an update about exhaust cost mate?