Found a Skoda weakness - tow ball load.

[wfdTamar]

I've found a weakness of Skoda's. The tow ball load limits are quite low.

Been looking at getting a caravan and on paper my car should be fine for a smaller van. Diesel, 1600kg load limit, but only 75kg ball limit. Even the Kodiak's limit is 80kg! A lot of European cars have a limit under 100kg. They just do caravan stability differently - rather than rely on the brute force of weight to achieve it, they rely on more finely balanced vans and stability hitches.

You can forget about any Australian style vans. You're restricted to European ones, but even amongst those there aren't many that have a tare ball weight light enough for an Octavia (in Australia).

[Guest001]

I've found a weakness of Skoda's. The tow ball load limits are quite low.

Been looking at getting a caravan and on paper my car should be fine for a smaller van. Diesel, 1600kg load limit, but only 75kg ball limit. Even the Kodiak's limit is 80kg! A lot of European cars have a limit under 100kg. They just do caravan stability differently - rather than rely on the brute force of weight to achieve it, they rely on more finely balanced vans and stability hitches.

You can forget about any Australian style vans. You're restricted to European ones, but even amongst those there aren't many that have a tare ball weight light enough for an Octavia (in Australia).


Nothing new almost all Euro cars are the same. Pays to check before buying

[Gerrycan]

I believe the Toureg ball weight is up around 200 kg

[wfdTamar]

I wasn't considering towing a caravan when I bought the car, but I had seen that it won numerous UK tow car of the year (in it's weight category) awards. So I presumed it would be ok and in the UK it would be, but not so easy here.

I've been using this site to check various cars to caravans.

Outfit Matching Car and Caravan (https://towcar.info/GB)


Also found this site which has a link to a PDF with loads of cars stats in it (a little out of date though). Vehicle Towing Mass Guide (although it's wrong for my car).

Helpful Hints & Tips - Ian Grant's Caravans (http://iangrantscaravans.com.au/hints-tips/)

[Guest001]

I wasn't considering towing a caravan when I bought the car, but I had seen that it won numerous UK tow car of the year (in it's weight category) awards. So I presumed it would be ok and in the UK it would be, but not so easy here.

I've been using this site to check various cars to caravans.

Outfit Matching Car and Caravan (https://towcar.info/GB)


Also found this site which has a link to a PDF with loads of cars stats in it (a little out of date though). Vehicle Towing Mass Guide (although it's wrong for my car).

Helpful Hints & Tips - Ian Grant's Caravans (http://iangrantscaravans.com.au/hints-tips/)

Hints from a long term vanner

The towball weight of a new van as listed by a dealer can be far from reality.

EG a van listed with a towball weight of 100kg WILL BE AT THE TARE of the van That is empty and when loaded up can be up to twice that.

I had a big van that the towball weight was listed as just over 200kg. In reality when we were travelling it varied from day today and was usually 290- 300kg Also it would pay you to join the "caravanersforum.com.au" for helpful suggestions (and Arguments) LOL .

For you to tow a van you would need to look at Eurovans like Baileys, Yorks, Adria or nowadays Jurgens make lightweight ones fitted out here in Australia. Almost any Aus van when loaded will have a towball weight in excess of your vehicles capacity .

Also to say it is a weakness is unfair as the vehicles are produced in Europe in great quantity where the towing regs are different and as that is the main market thats what they build for. The small size of the AUS market does not justify meeting our towing conditions which to a large extent are old school where weight is defined as strength and isnt necessarily so.
Must be bad roads in Europe and we dont hear of their "lightweight" vans falling to pieces all over the place.

If you want to go vanning in Aus you need either a van as above or a tug that can tow our behemoths

[Guest001]

I've found a weakness of Skoda's. The tow ball load limits are quite low.

Been looking at getting a caravan and on paper my car should be fine for a smaller van. Diesel, 1600kg load limit, but only 75kg ball limit. Even the Kodiak's limit is 80kg! A lot of European cars have a limit under 100kg. They just do caravan stability differently - rather than rely on the brute force of weight to achieve it, they rely on more finely balanced vans and stability hitches.

You can forget about any Australian style vans. You're restricted to European ones, but even amongst those there aren't many that have a tare ball weight light enough for an Octavia (in Australia).

Tare ball weight means nothing. No one goes away with an empty van and as I said it increases it markedly once you load the van up.

Also a great majority of vans will have an incorrect Tareweight on the compliance plate as most just make a line of vans and plate them all the same. Jayco are one maker that weighs each van.

There has actually been instances where the buyer has specified extras and the plate hasnt been altered and it was found that the actual Tare almost exceeded the vans legal loaded limit and hence not fit for purpose. True story.

[wfdTamar]

Yes, thanks, but you're telling me stuff I know already :-) and yes, joined various forums, had arguments with various silly old duffers who couldn't logic their way out of paper bags, or even follow a discussion, or recognise what a simple question is (very frustrating). I find this is one of those areas people (usually men) love to talk at you, not with you.

Huuuuge amount of misinterpretation of what van Tare ball weight and Max ball weight means, even from dealers (well, c'mon, they are selling caravans, so not geniuses). Tare ball weight actually does mean something, as your limited to vans that have one within your cars max ball load weight. As you say, once you load the van ACTUAL ball weight can vary, but the tare ball weight is the starting point. No point looking at vans whose tare ball weight exceeds your car's max ball limit.

I have still yet to find out if that is a legal requirement (that van tare ball weight not exceed car ball weight limit). I don't think so.

Even considered another car - Passat is 90kg, Volvo XC70 90. Problem is to get a much higher limit you're looking at vehicles that chew almost twice the fuel (before you even put a van on). Maybe once you're towing that disparity may not be so great. Mercedes ML320 if you want a really big van. Or yes Toureg. I was expecting my car to go from 5.5 litres per 100 to around 10. Maybe say, the Merc or Toureg would go from 9.6 to 15?

BUT - biggest stumbling block is previous mentioned old duffers using the 'oh yer ball weight has ter be 10% of yer van weight rubbish'. Completely missing the point that this is a Euro car and Euro van, NOT a 4WD with an Australian van.

Yes, been looking primarily at UK market Baileys (the Australian ones are usually made to nose heavy), Geist and the like. However, the encounters on forums with all these silly old fools has really put me off the idea of caravanning. I wasn't sure if being cooped up in crowded caravan parks with boozing, noisy bogans and their mutts yapping etc. was for me and that pretty much sealed it.

It also seems the height of western privileged, baby boomer selfishness to lug around a portable house burning up fossil fuel and the ozone layer.

[Guest001]

The ball weight may not exceed whatever the car manufacturer states what it is. There is no legal limit other than that. You constantly refer to TARE BALL WEIGHT which is meaning less except as you say if its too high you cant buy it.

No good either buying one with a ballweight 10kg less than your maximum because it will be well over when you load it up.
Far better to ask what is the ballweight at ATM
You do not have to mix with the other campers We spent 2 years vanning around the country and stuck to ourselves mostly. Didnt have any problems and in fact made friends with a couple in 2009 who we still visit each other .
Yes fuel will go up Our Landcuiser did 10.5 on its own on the highway but averaged about 18 towing and on one bad day on the Stuart in a head wind was about 23L -100km
If you are so worried about the enviroment etc pehaps you should buy a bike . LOL


By the look of your mods in your sig you dont seem to be worrying too much

[wfdTamar]

Exactly - if the van tare ball weight is too high, you can't (or shouldn't) buy it. That's the trouble - 75 kg car limit! Not too many vans that low. That's why it's a constant issue. Also tare ball weight anything up to the cars limit is fine - then it's a matter of correct loading. It is not inevitable that it will increase when loaded. If it does, its loaded incorrectly. This is easier with a Euro van, having their axle more toward the middle of the van (than ones built here). European vans work more on the cart principle than the wheelbarrow. If people in the UK with Octavia's only bought vans that were well under the max ball weight they would never tow a van at all.

Why do you presume because I have bought 'performance' stuff I race around at 100mph? My current tanks consumption is 5.2 litres per 100km (with a ten year old car). On the contrary, I cosset my car as I want it to last and I do think about my impact on the environment.

[Transporter]

Maybe our caravans aren’t built to the world standard. :?

Or should I say European standard.

[Guest001]

Quote"Also tare ball weight anything up to the cars limit is fine - then it's a matter of correct loading. It is not inevitable that it will increase when loaded. If it does, its loaded incorrectly".. Says who.

Hmm a person who doesnt have a van preaching to the experienced

It is desirable to have a certain amount of positive ball weight for stability. even at the Octavias very low tow limit of 1400kg it should have a ball weight of over 5% which is right on your limit even if a Euro van A 1400kg AUS van would have at least 120-140kg

. You have a lot to learn about towing and weights. I did point out that VWs were built to tow Eurovans but we are not in Europe. If you buy a Euro van you will probably be fine. Otherwise if you want to go vanning you may have to consider a more suitable tow vehicle for our Aussie conditions.

Hooray for your consumption I get 4.9 out of the Polo

[Transporter]

Quote"Also tare ball weight anything up to the cars limit is fine - then it's a matter of correct loading. It is not inevitable that it will increase when loaded. If it does, its loaded incorrectly"..

Says who.
Hmm a person who doesnt have a van preaching to the experienced. You have a lot to learn about towing and weights. I did point out that VWs were built to tow Eurovans but we are not in Europe. If you buy a Euro van you will probably be fine. Otherwise if you want to go vanning you may have to consider a more suitable tow vehicle for our Aussie conditions.

Hooray for your consumption I get 4.9 out of the Polo

Old Holden Kingswood? :)

[Guest001]

Maybe our caravans aren’t built to the world standard. :?

Or should I say European standard.

Or maybe a certain persons standard

[wfdTamar]

They're just different. Tougher, or rather, more crudely built and they rely on weight for stability where the Euro ones are lighter to save fuel and because their roads are better (generally) and they use smart hitches for stability. Also means you don't need big heavy vehicles to tow them.

It's just like US vans seem to be bigger and loaded up with heavy fittings - weight is no problem with low fuel prices.

[wfdTamar]

Ha ha, this is like the conversations I had on the caravaners forums. People who are wrong and can't admit it, or see that they might be. Who go off on a tangent thinking they're telling you things you don't know. Quite tedious.

My cars limits are 1600/75 - about 4.75%. I have seen approx. 1500kg ATM Euro vans with tare ball weights of 60kg. I'm not even considering Australian vans as I know they're not suitable for the car. I'm not looking to do the Tanami track. Sure if you buy a Euro car and van you're more limited than if you buy a 4WD and Australian off road van, but you use a hell of a lot less fuel.

Don't have a van but passed English at school so know how to read and interpret it.

'Says who?' the rest of what I wrote - loads of UK Octavia owners towing vans. Logic and the basic principles of leverage and mechanics. The fact it won tow car awards. If you were correct it couldn't do that surely?

Great you get 4.9 from a Polo. and?

All I said was (warning potential buyers) a weakness of Skoda's is the low ball weight limit. Correct response surely is something like, 'yes, it's a shame. Probably does limit our choice of vans we can use. Funny that some VW cars have a slightly higher limit.'

I really don't see it as something to get rude about.

[Guest001]

They're just different. Tougher, or rather, more crudely built and they rely on weight for stability where the Euro ones are lighter to save fuel and because their roads are better (generally) and they use smart hitches for stability. Also means you don't need big heavy vehicles to tow them.

It's just like US vans seem to be bigger and loaded up with heavy fittings - weight is no problem with low fuel prices.

I seem to recall saying that in my replies. A Smart hitch wont save you when you whack the brakes on at 100kph and the van starts to take over. All it does is clamp the hitch tighter onto the ball to resist sway to a certain degree. However a university study in Great Britain showed that loading had more to do with it than tight balls.

USA have predominatly fifth wheelers by a ratio of at least 10 to 1 saw thousands of them in my last two trips over there but very few caravans like we have here. Also the tugs used in the USA are predominantly light trucks with a much higher tow capacity than the ones we have here EG a F250 or 350 can tow well over 4 tonnes whereas none of our utes can do that

I dont see the low ball weight as a weakness as you put it just something to be aware of as I was when I bought the Passat I checked before I bought it and as it was low didnt bother with a tow bar. HAd I want to tow I would have bought something suitable

[wfdTamar]

A Smart hitch wont save you when you whack the brakes on at 100kph and the van starts to take over. All it does is clamp the hitch tighter onto the ball to resist sway to a certain degree

.......

Er, yes it will. They have brakes - well as good as any other van will. In fact, I'd rather have that setup than 150-200kg pushing down hard on the tow bar (no matter what the vehicle).

[Jondalar]

I wasn't considering towing a caravan when I bought the car, but I had seen that it won numerous UK tow car of the year (in it's weight category) awards. So I presumed it would be ok and in the UK it would be, but not so easy here.

I've been using this site to check various cars to caravans.

Outfit Matching Car and Caravan (https://towcar.info/GB)


Also found this site which has a link to a PDF with loads of cars stats in it (a little out of date though). Vehicle Towing Mass Guide (although it's wrong for my car).

Helpful Hints & Tips - Ian Grant's Caravans (http://iangrantscaravans.com.au/hints-tips/)

Thanks for the van matching site, very interesting. It's a shame there's no equivalent site for Aussie vans, but then perhaps they'd stop making such inefficient (weighwise) vans here. My wife and I had caravans for many years but sold up in 2016 to concentrate on overseas travel. I was also sick of having to drive a big 4X4. There are definitely Adria vans sold here that you could tow and not all caravanning involves staying in a crowded van park. My fave part was the Outback, or remote coastal areas.