T6 Transporter/Multivan/Caravelle

[Transporter]

Somehow, I can't believe that VW would not give us to choose the transmission option?

It seems, that the one can have any configuration, as long as it is with the 7sp. DSG.

Then, perhaps they should put 10years warranty on the DSG. What do you guys think?

[Bryn23]

The days of car manufacturer offering manual's is almost over with higher emission targets.

Come Euro 7 spec, it'll be hard to find a manual.

As for the 10 year warranty, yes there should be a 10 year drive line warranty, they should stand behind there product, as a manual is normally almost bullet proof other than the clutch.

[Umai Naa!!]

Manual Multivans and Caravelles in the T5 and T5GP weren't that common anyway.

Besides, the 7-speed DQ500 DSG is not a bad thing. Failures are fairly uncommon.

[Transporter]

Manual Multivans and Caravelles in the T5 and T5GP weren't that common anyway.

Besides, the 7-speed DQ500 DSG is not a bad thing. Failures are fairly uncommon.

Not so great for the long term reliability and trouble free.
Why would I pay more for the DSG and then pay again when it's old and needs rebuild or an expensive repair?

The fuel economy from 4x4 Sprinter ;)


27612

My long term average is 9L/100km

[Sunny43.5]

I,m with you Transporter seems wrong to restrict the options that are probably available overseas but not here in Australia , the new T6 is available in Europe with the 2.0 petrol Turbo probably more reliable and less expensive than the DPF equipped diesel that lots complain about with known problems . As for the DSG I am not convinced its going to be a long term reliable box , but as a victim of the Tiptronic I am very cautious with our DSG van . I just cannot be convinced that it will be a reliable box considering all the electronics inside , ours has already had problems when it was near new . Some may not realise that the DSG was a huge problem on several continents , yes I know the van DSG is a different one to other VW models . But when you read how the Chinese Government made VW give owners a ten year warranty after the debacle in half a million DSG equipped VWs , it makes you wonder how we are going to be treated down the track .

[LogicprObe]

Not so great for the long term reliability and trouble free.
Why would I pay more for the DSG and then pay again when it's old and needs rebuild or an expensive repair?

The fuel economy from 4x4 Sprinter ;)


27612

My long term average is 9L/100km

Given that barn doors are becoming very, very rare on the Transporter range, I had a look at the Crafter.
Manual only and they just had a price drop on the base model.
The downside I read was that they are shifting production from Germany to Poland this year.

2016 Volkswagen Crafter to Be Built in Wrzesnia, Poland - autoevolution (http://www.autoevolution.com/news/2016-volkswagen-crafter-to-be-built-in-wrzesnia-poland-78754.html)

[Tornado T5]

Go to the VW UK configuration site and you'll fall over in disbelief at what is available and how limiting VWAust is.

[Tornado T5]

I may have mentioned this somewhere else so forgive me, coffee hasn't kicked in yet, ...I rang VW Aust last month and asked that considering Euro6 is a requirement in Aust for any vehicle built after a set date later in 2017 will the TDI 450 be offered in Transporters?

I said I will wait and delay my purchase if so. The answer was 2 engines are being evaluated however I couldn't be told which ones they were. Now obviously in the UK a 110KW and 150Kw TDI Euro6 options are offered and the 150kW is already offered in Multivans here, so it's not exactly a top secret situation. I couldn't see VW only offering the 110kw and a lower power unit similar to the current Runner offering, but you never know. It would however leave them well behind the Vito 119's 140Kw. The Vito locally also offers a factory fitted 30/70 split fold and roll forward/completely removable 2nd row bench which VW also offers but only overseas.

[Tornado T5]

Given that barn doors are becoming very, very rare on the Transporter range, I had a look at the Crafter.
Manual only and they just had a price drop on the base model.
The downside I read was that they are shifting production from Germany to Poland this year.

2016 Volkswagen Crafter to Be Built in Wrzesnia, Poland - autoevolution (http://www.autoevolution.com/news/2016-volkswagen-crafter-to-be-built-in-wrzesnia-poland-78754.html)
I'd wait for the new Crafter if possible, 8 speed conventional auto, far better looking and some great features if the local bananas decide to offer them.

[jets]

Not so great for the long term reliability and trouble free.
Why would I pay more for the DSG and then pay again when it's old and needs rebuild or an expensive repair?


As repairs become more & more expensive & cars/vans depreciate faster, there will be a pile of scrapped cars waiting to be crushed.
Maybe, with electric vans just around the corner it's inevitable anyway.
In the case of the T4, the youngest being around 13 years, there is increasing interest in conversion to manual trans.
In the UK there are some available from the wreckers, but in the US they have to go back to a '93 to find a manual donor.
I am prepared for the future. All my cars/van are manual that will probably last until they take my licence away.

[Transporter]

I'd wait for the new Crafter if possible, 8 speed conventional auto, far better looking and some great features if the local bananas decide to offer them.

That Crafter will be with the east/west engine configuration, unless you want to wait even longer for the RWD variant. The 4Mo will also be the east/west set up, so unless it's superb vehicle, I'll be driving my Sprinter 4x4 for a bit longer until something crops up, maybe the Rockton will come to Au again. But, I know for sure that I'll never buy 4motion T6 with the DSG with the 3 years warranty only.
When there is an Iveco with the manual box, 205PS/470Nm 3.0L TDI, built on the proper chassis and can be had with RWD and factory diff lock, or full blown 4x4 with 3 diff locks and 2 reduction gearboxes.
:)

[Sunny43.5]

As repairs become more & more expensive & cars/vans depreciate faster, there will be a pile of scrapped cars waiting to be crushed.
Maybe, with electric vans just around the corner it's inevitable anyway.
In the case of the T4, the youngest being around 13 years, there is increasing interest in conversion to manual trans.
In the UK there are some available from the wreckers, but in the US they have to go back to a '93 to find a manual donor.
I am prepared for the future. All my cars/van are manual that will probably last until they take my licence away.
I agree the manuals are pretty bullet proof just a shame they mated it to that diabolical DMF thingy , my T5 work horse has now over 300000kays and its married to the pitiful 2.0 litre petrol engine { VW should have fitted a turbo like the new T6 in Europe has } but at least after 300000 kays it has only cost me one clutch kit around $600 . Unlike our previous family van where its Tiptronic failed after only 120000 kays at around $8500 for a non genuine rebuild { $12500 dealer price } DSG ? well the jury is out but I am still incredibly vigilant with our current one after it faltered twice at only two weeks old .

[LogicprObe]

Just about any Euro diesel will have a DMF these days.
You'd be pretty lucky if you got a petrol T6 in Australia.
I think they are special order.

[tdi]

Just about any Euro diesel will have a DMF these days.
You'd be pretty lucky if you got a petrol T6 in Australia.
I think they are special order.

I was initially thinking of ordering a petrol T6 but Volkswagen Australia told me they can't be ordered.

[Sunny43.5]

Yes it seems that VW Australia have once again misread the market expectations of Australian drivers , for years we were bombarded by the economy of the diesel engines so every man and his dog got on board offering diesels in almost every brand . Now it seems that some of the new generation petrol engines can be just as economical and less polluting than diesels T6 turbo petrol as a case in question . But again Australian buyers are not given the option . I noticed in a video that came out when the T6 was released in late 2015 a reviewer in Germany even stated some models of the diesel equipped T6 would be hard pressed to successfully carry the load expected . But if you want an Amarok yes you can get a V6 engine so why not the vans ? lets face it many van owners would probably want to carry or tow similar weights as the Amarok .

[Umai Naa!!]

Please show me how a longitudinal V6 fits into a T5/6 engine bay.

[Transporter]

Please show me how a longitudinal V6 fits into a T5/6 engine bay.

Similarly sized or maybe even a fraction smaller Vito is available with V6 3.0L engine longitudinaly fitted. So, why VW shouldn't be able to do it?
It's not that hard, even if you have to make the van's front a little bit longer it would be worth it. Though the Vito's front is maybe even shorter.
Sadly, it's much easier for manufacturer to fit engine from the Golf into the Transporter and even Sprinter.

[Umai Naa!!]

You might as well start from scratch.

There's no way in the world an Amarok/Touareg drivetrain would fit in a T5, and be suitable for mass-production. The vans were never designed with this in mind in the first place.

[Sunny43.5]

Well there were V6 engines in the T4 and I did not notice any modifications made to those , I suppose they could have made allowances for the V6 option in the T5 but they then had the 2.5 TDI so it was preferred engine . And I am sure you would know the V6 in the T4 was east west anyway .Out of interest before VW days I had a 4cylinder Toyota Hi Ace with a 1600cc engine , I got sick of lousy performance and shoehorned a 186 Holden 6 cylinder engine into the engine bay , if you know the model Hi ace the engine was under the front seat and I made it fit with some home made modifications . Raised the engine cover 25mm made my own new engine mounts and welded them to the subframe plus new gearbox mounts and exhaust plus modified radiators [yes two ] had to keep the sucker cool somehow . So at a factory level I am sure they could do the same for a V6 in a VW
Please show me how a longitudinal V6 fits into a T5/6 engine bay.

[Umai Naa!!]

That's a VR6 fitted to the early T5 and T4.

It's about half the width of the CRTDI V6 in the Touareg and Amarok, because it only has one cylinder head. And even then, it was a very snug fit.

27646

It's not going to fit.

[Transporter]

That's a VR6 fitted to the early T5 and T4.

It's about half the width of the CRTDI V6 in the Touareg and Amarok, because it only has one cylinder head. And even then, it was a very snug fit.

27646

It's not going to fit.

Would fit longitudinally.
....and what's stopping VW to modify the body to fit the V6 or develop a new V6. A new Crafter will have engines fitted both ways.

[Sunny43.5]

Yes I suppose the development and cost will be so far out in the future that they will have us all by then driving remote controlled battery cars anyway .

[Umai Naa!!]

Would fit longitudinally.
....and what's stopping VW to modify the body to fit the V6 or develop a new V6. A new Crafter will have engines fitted both ways.

As I said, they may as well start from scratch with a clean-sheet design.

[Tornado T5]

And lets be really frank the T6 is a dashboard upgrade with minor exterior tweak. IMHO, it doesn't deserve the T6 name considering what was upgraded/updated over a T5GP. One think I discovered though, the tailgated T6 has different tailights and profile to a rear wing doored model, the wing door has a carry over profile from the T5. I only noted this after I thought about buying a T6 with tailgate as there is pretty much no stock in the country of wing doored vans and then swapping them over with my van as I would keep my T5.

[Tornado T5]

That Crafter will be with the east/west engine configuration, unless you want to wait even longer for the RWD variant. The 4Mo will also be the east/west set up, so unless it's superb vehicle, I'll be driving my Sprinter 4x4 for a bit longer until something crops up, maybe the Rockton will come to Au again. But, I know for sure that I'll never buy 4motion T6 with the DSG with the 3 years warranty only.
When there is an Iveco with the manual box, 205PS/470Nm 3.0L TDI, built on the proper chassis and can be had with RWD and factory diff lock, or full blown 4x4 with 3 diff locks and 2 reduction gearboxes.
:)It would make for high repayments but a 3 year/0% balloon would solve that risk or maybe a "factory" extended warranty and more common 5/yr terms :).
My only problem is that a mid-size van, Vito/T6 suits my needs best with a need to get into CBD carparks and can be used as a weekend 2nd car and parked inside my driveway.

[Sunny43.5]

Yes and I wonder which part of VW decided that the T6 should have drink holders in the top of the dash ? might be convenient but pretty stupid in our climate . The head unit is the same size as the T5 .2 so all they did was make the facia different .
And lets be really frank the T6 is a dashboard upgrade with minor exterior tweak. IMHO, it doesn't deserve the T6 name considering what was upgraded/updated over a T5GP. One think I discovered though, the tailgated T6 has different tailights and profile to a rear wing doored model, the wing door has a carry over profile from the T5. I only noted this after I thought about buying a T6 with tailgate as there is pretty much no stock in the country of wing doored vans and then swapping them over with my van as I would keep my T5.

[Bryn23]

Yes and I wonder which part of VW decided that the T6 should have drink holders in the top of the dash ? might be convenient but pretty stupid in our climate . The head unit is the same size as the T5 .2 so all they did was make the facia different .

Same goes for my Honda, that has its cup holders in front of the air con outlet.

I have to smash that hot coffee before the aircon turns it into a iced coffee.

The T6 cup holders are quite a distance away from the seat as well, it'll keep my coffee warm, but ill be stretching to reach it.

[Tornado T5]

Similarly sized or maybe even a fraction smaller Vito is available with V6 3.0L engine longitudinaly fitted. So, why VW shouldn't be able to do it?
It's not that hard, even if you have to make the van's front a little bit longer it would be worth it. Though the Vito's front is maybe even shorter.
Sadly, it's much easier for manufacturer to fit engine from the Golf into the Transporter and even Sprinter.
And you should see how well those Vito 122cdi v6's are holding their value...I thought long and hard about buying a Vito 122cdi Crewvan (only comes in mid-wheel base) which was $52K, 40,000Km until the Christmas rush showed me that I really still need the long wheel base length of a Vito/T6. And then there's the fact almost $62K (list price) drive away gets you can get a brand new heavily optioned T6 with 2nd a/c, dual sliding doors, 4motion/dsg/lwb, glass all round but no factory 2nd row of seats, rather an aftermarket set with no split fold.

While ranting :) you can buy a Caravelle LWB with all the interior trim lining, full glass, twin sliding elec.doors, 9 seats, rear passenger airbags for LESS than a Transporter...but there's no wing door option or tdi400 though....wtf.

[Transporter]

And lets be really frank the T6 is a dashboard upgrade with minor exterior tweak. IMHO, it doesn't deserve the T6 name considering what was upgraded/updated over a T5GP. One think I discovered though, the tailgated T6 has different tailights and profile to a rear wing doored model, the wing door has a carry over profile from the T5. I only noted this after I thought about buying a T6 with tailgate as there is pretty much no stock in the country of wing doored vans and then swapping them over with my van as I would keep my T5.

I couldn't agree more.

[Zaskar]

I was at a dealer today doing some preliminary investigation. I have a 2012 crewvan and i want to get a new one. Turns out the caravelle is cheaper even with 9 seats and all the fluffy comforts.
The 2012 crewvan was perfect for me, as it had air con in the rear. The new 2017 crewvan has it as an $2000 optional extra. Standard of course on the caravelle.

the issue of manual vs auto is also solved by VW offering auto or auto. do i look elsewhere like Vito or Iload?

[Zaskar]

what are your thoughts on the italian LDV?

[Umai Naa!!]

Aren't they Chinese copies of a British thing?

[Tornado T5]

I was at a dealer today doing some preliminary investigation. I have a 2012 crewvan and i want to get a new one. Turns out the caravelle is cheaper even with 9 seats and all the fluffy comforts.
The 2012 crewvan was perfect for me, as it had air con in the rear. The new 2017 crewvan has it as an $2000 optional extra. Standard of course on the caravelle.

the issue of manual vs auto is also solved by VW offering auto or auto. do i look elsewhere like Vito or Iload?I've been dragging my buying "wallet" for months now.
The first thing I noticed is T6 has better build quality and finish then Vito. Check out rear door wiring on the Vito and you'll see electrical tape wrapped around the exposed wiring to the inside of the doors and some trim fit is not as good..on a $$ Merc lol.
Vito is euro6 already, T6 only on the tdi450 and VW Aust hasn't stated which engines they'll put in T6 in 2nd half of this year when euro6 is compulsary on all new builds.
Vito offers 140kW/7spd auto on all models, T6 CrewVan only has tdi340 dsg (for now?) and no 4motion.
Vito CrewCab has far better seat config for 2nd row then T6 CrewVan, 70:30 split fold.
Vito has twin sliding doors standard.
T6 Crewvan comes in short and long wheel base. Vito Crewcab is mid-wheel base only.
I think the VW drives slightly better but in slippery condition's or heavy towing Vito's rwd would be better unless you option 4motion.
And yes, the Caravelle is cheaper then a mildly optioned Transporter but has 9 seats, twin sliding doors, full glass all round, 2nd a/c, full interior trim lining and 2nd row airbags....I'm astounded as to why??
iLoad is smaller, decent power, Crewvan option but cargo space is just a standard pallet size behind 2nd row seats, too small for me. iload is nearing end of current model's life.
If you don't mind the power output of the tdi340 and don't need wing doors, a Caravelle is great value.

[Tornado T5]

Aren't they Chinese copies of a British thing?
Bought out by Chinese owners, not sure if production shifted.

[Sunny43.5]

Yes production was shifted to China lock stock and barrel , I remember reading about this a few years ago . apparently the LDV was a hugely popular model back in the UK this bit from Wiki ..
LDV Group Limited, formerly Leyland DAF Vans, was a British van manufacturer, based in the Ward End area of Birmingham.
Historically part of Rover Group and Leyland DAF, it was latterly a wholly owned subsidiary of the Russian GAZ group. Owing to the worldwide recession and a lack of long-term investment, production was halted at LDV's Birmingham factory in December 2008.
After a series of failed rescue attempts in 2009, the assets of the company were sold by administrators PricewaterhouseCoopers to China Venture's firm Eco Concept, on 15 October 2009.[1]

[Transporter]

Go to the VW UK configuration site and you'll fall over in disbelief at what is available and how limiting VWAust is.

Well, if VW Australia want to limit us only to DSG and stop bringing the vans with manual gearbox, then perhaps we should and I definitely will be looking elsewhere for the van.

I've already roadtested the new Iveco, which looks worthy alternative, has fantastic turning circle, they have plenty of configurations available, the smallest one is 7.3 cubic meters load space and only fraction bigger than LWB T5, longitudinal drivetrain arrangement, 100L fuel tank (75L on 4x4) and no DPF. It also comes with satnav as std. bigger 3.0L t.diesel with 205ps and 470Nm can be had with 6sp manual or 8speed ZF auto (RWD only) which has a better reputation than the DSG and it will be easier to sell after 5 or 10 years than the VW with the DSG. The warranty is 3 years 200,000km.

[Sunny43.5]

Stop it Transporter your making my mouth water !:cool46:

[Tornado T5]

Well, if VW Australia want to limit us only to DSG and stop bringing the vans with manual gearbox, then perhaps we should and I definitely will be looking elsewhere for the van.

I've already roadtested the new Iveco, which looks worthy alternative, has fantastic turning circle, they have plenty of configurations available, the smallest one is 7.3 cubic meters load space and only fraction bigger than LWB T5, longitudinal drivetrain arrangement, 100L fuel tank (75L on 4x4) and no DPF. It also comes with satnav as std. bigger 3.0L t.diesel with 205ps and 470Nm can be had with 6sp manual or 8speed ZF auto (RWD only) which has a better reputation than the DSG and it will be easier to sell after 5 or 10 years than the VW with the DSG. The warranty is 3 years 200,000km.I'll admit I looked at the Iveco solely on your previous post Transporter. While the looks take some getting used to it does offer a very worthy alternative in the large van segment. Sadly the lowest height variant is 2200mm (T6=1990mm) and 5128mm (T6 lwb=5290mm) so it's actually shorter than a T6 lwb. The overall height sadly means I couldn't enter many CBD carparks. The "non-dsg" 8 speed auto seems great in all reviews although the all-new Crafter is getting a similar type of box iirc....wonder why.

I know T6 sales are up but do you think VW Australia has had any feedback from previuos owners like us that have had multiple vans but cannot commit to a new one as easily as in past purchases? They seem to be selling mostly the Runner and the margins cannot be great compared to what some us us looking at several options and higher spec would spend.

PS. the Iveco's 470Nm @1400-3000rpm (T6 tdi450=450Nm @ 1,400-2,400rpm if it becomes available in Transporters) is a delivery van driver's diesel fed dream :)

[Sunny43.5]

I was reading a report in the paper yesterday on the latest V6 Amarok selling at around $60 k they went to great lengths to say that VW and their dealers are making a motza on these as they according to reports are as cheap as chips to build , makes you wonder about the Transporter range doesn't it . How hard can it be to build a box body over a chassis with an engine gear box 4 wheels and two seats , seems sort of lopsided when you see better equipped vehicles in various configurations for a hell of a lot less bucks .

[Kiels3927]

Isn'twasn't Transporter built in Germany & Amarok in South America or some place?

[Transporter]

Stop it Transporter your making my mouth water !:cool46:

Wait until you try and see the Iveco's front bench seat. :P

[Bryn23]

if Iveco did an auto with low range 4x4 6 mtr van it would be a hot seller fro a campervan conversion

There is the 4x4 sprinter, but its way to $$$$, well for me it is.

[Zaskar]

Ive been told Amarok was built in SthAm, but moving back to Germany later this year.


Isn'twasn't Transporter built in Germany & Amarok in South America or some place?

[Tornado T5]

Just as I was ready to negotiate on a T6, Merc go and release a LWB Vito Crewcab (Merc speak for Crewvan).

[Sunny43.5]

I thought Mercedes already had both SWB and LWB already for many years or is this in a new shape ?

[Tornado T5]

I thought Mercedes already had both SWB and LWB already for many years or is this in a new shape ?
Overseas there are SWB, MWB and LWB Vito Van and Vito Crewvan versions.
In the last two Vito models the Crewvan only came in MWB length in Aust. For the current 447 Vito a LWB Crewvan adds about 33cm of interior cargo length behind the 2nd row and matches the VW Transporter LWB. The Vito has superior rear seat flexibilty.

[Sunny43.5]

Thanks for that I haven't really been following Mercedes vans so it was new to me .

[irsa76]

One thing I've noticed about Mercedes dealers, is that they tend to treat vans as second class citizens, experienced this from both sides as a dealer mechanic and later a customer, albeit a company driver but then again the company I work for was at one point the largest Sprinter customer in the world. To the point "my" Sprinter was a T1N SWB 313 Sprintshift 3.5t, a model not available to the general public, had a few other interesting options such as no windows, 3rd brake light, rear step and 100L fuel tank. Local dealer still messed us around, know a fair few other Mercedes van owners who had the same experiences.
Personally I'd have a look at Renault offerings, only considering a Multivan because Renault won't do a passenger version of the Trafic for Australia and the Citroen Spacetourer hasn't been confirmed for Australia.

[Transporter]

Thanks for that I haven't really been following Mercedes vans so it was new to me .

I'd stay away from MB, the built quality is iffy, body and mechanical.